Way to go Mississippi

[smileyeagle1021]

And by way to go, I mean you have finally done something that may finally drive my mother away from the church (yes, I know, I'm bitter, but I've earned that right).
Constance sent to fake prom (http://advocate.com/News/Daily_News/2010/04/05/ACLU_Investigating_Fake_Prom/)

Yup, the conservative Christian's hate the idea of equality so much that they committed a conspiracy to make sure that a lesbian could not attend Prom. They also sent two kids with learning disabilities there... God, does the Christian hatred know no bounds... they hate homosexuals and the disabled. Only 7 people were sent to that prom, no mention was made of what was "wrong" with the other three, but I'm sure they were sent there for equally Christian reasons.

These people disgust me.

[Greenday]

You honestly expected something different to happen? I'm not surprised at all. Way to keep the stereotypes going strong for the South, Mississippi!

[Ghel]

Smiley, the way you say "the church" makes it look like you think that every Christian group thinks exactly the same way. And we all know that's not true. There are as many different sets of beliefs as there are Christians.

But it wasn't the local church that did this (not officially, anyway). It was the school and the school board that canceled prom. From your link, it seems that it was one of the students that directed Ms. McMillen to the "fake" prom.

I agree that the whole situation is horrible. And though the church's teachings are most likely what prompted the school's and students' actions, it is the individuals, not the church, who are discriminating against this student.

[smileyeagle1021]

it is the individuals, not the church, who are discriminating against this student.

after living in what might as well be a theocracy for 5 years, I see very little difference between the two. A church is only as good as it's members, which is why I refuse to ever again be a member of one, I refuse to let them bring me down more than they have.
Considering the United Methodist Church lied to me and said I'd be accepted and pretended to welcome me with open arms and gladly took my money... which they then turned around and used to block marriage equality in Maine. I haven't told them I left because I know it costs them a few bucks a month to mail me their newsletter and that is a few bucks a month they can't spend betraying others. So whether or not any one church was responsible for this debacle or as you said, individuals following what they believe to be the teachings of the church, the church is guilty as sin.

[Fryk]

If the chaperones were all at the country club, then to me it sounds like the other kids organized their own thing and didn't invite her. Sounds more like the kids are to blame.

[elsporko]

While this sucks for the lesbian, this was a private event. The last time I checked the government can't force people to be friends.

[Rapscallion]

While this sucks for the lesbian, this was a private event. The last time I checked the government can't force people to be friends.

This isn't about forcing people to be friends, this is a clear case of conspiracy to discriminate.

I don't know the US's laws well enough, but I rather think that the schools come under federal anti-discrimination legislation, and since the country club event was eventually declared to be the official alternative to the prom then it's a school event and comes under those laws.

Rapscallion

[Ghel]

Well, unfortunately, the school probably won't get any backlash regarding the "fake" prom because they can say it was organized by the students and their parents. On the other hand, the court ruling says that this kind of thing can't happen again.

[Arcade Man D]

While this sucks for the lesbian, this was a private event. The last time I checked the government can't force people to be friends.

The private event *was* set up by the school. So yes, it was an attempt to make an end-run around the court rulings.

[Nyoibo]

And one of the reasons the court didn't force them to re-instate the prom was because it was understood she was invited to the private party.

[smileyeagle1021]

While this sucks for the lesbian, this was a private event. The last time I checked the government can't force people to be friends.

No, they can't... that doesn't change the fact that everyone involved is the vilest of vile and proves just how right I am to despise the church.
I'm to the point that I haven't told the Methodist church that I've left because I know it costs them a few bucks a month to send me a newsletter and that's a few buck a month they can't spend on Christ's spread of hatred.

[elsporko]

Good point. This action that is has nothing to do with any church proves that churches are evil and you are a bigot.

[Nyoibo]

While this sucks for the lesbian, this was a private event. The last time I checked the government can't force people to be friends.

Not, it can't force them to be friends, but it can force them to interact.

"The judge declined to force the school district to hold the prom because a parent-sponsored, private prom was being organized — and the understanding was that McMillen and her date were invited to that event."

Otherwise it looks like the judge would have made the school put the prom on.

[smileyeagle1021]

Good point. This action that is has nothing to do with any church proves that churches are evil and you are a bigot.

Yes, they are the pot, I am the kettle, we are well acquainted. I never claimed I wasn't bigoted, just that after all that has happened in my life that I've earned that privilege and that it is mostly justified.

[telecom_goddess]

looks like elsporko is banned now...guess he said one too many!

[ArenaBoy]

This is despicable. Basically there was a fake prom held because of a student's sexual orientation.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/candace-gingrich/prom-shocker-constance-mc_b_527280.html

[smileyeagle1021]

Pictures from the secret real prom, you know the one for the good Christians to go to, have surfaced on the internet.
They are quite enlightening (http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/273/03e6ec2ce4f5e0da5cb8b0c.jpg)

Hypochristians indeed.

[insertNameHere]

Pictures from the secret real prom, you know the one for the good Christians to go to, have surfaced on the internet.
They are quite enlightening (http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/273/03e6ec2ce4f5e0da5cb8b0c.jpg)

Hypochristians indeed.

Anyone else notice the two girls kissing in the bottom image? I'm not saying that her classmates have to like her and even be friends. If they want to hold a private party and exclude her because she is different that is fine, but denying her from attending prom which is a major event of being in high school, is just pathetic.
I know the spin on the "fake" prom is that it will have in fact be the real prom. And none of the other students wanted to attend it, of course attendance isn't helped when you have a more fun place to be.

[Talon]

Absurd and petulant. Here's a terrific dressing-down:

Fulton, Mississippi: Segregationist, Heterosupremacist Hellhole (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUSe8OVKERM&playnext_from=TL&videos=8IOCTmWD6os&feature=recentlik)

[Hyena Dandy]

When you say "the church" do you mean the particular church in that town, the particular denomination for the church in that town, or all of Christianity? Because all of Christianity doesn't behave like that.

But that's not what's important.

And nobody has a RIGHT to be a bigot. Although I suspect there was a misunderstanding in your previous religious dealings (the church community may have accepted you, but their money goes to an organization, and the organization didn't accept you) But in any case. You have a right to feel betrayed, and even, if you want, to hate the people who have betrayed you. But no matter what you've gone through, you don't have a right to be a bigot against people who haven't harmed you.

You also, obviously, have the right to dislike the people who committed this act. But being betrayed by the United Methodist Church does not give you the right to call all Christians homophobic bigots.

Then again, you have the right to your opinions, and you obviously have the right to call someone a bigot.

What I'm trying to get across here is.

Bigotry doesn't become acceptable if you've been persecuted.

That's what I feel strongly about in this post. The rest of it is me rambling to try to get the point across.

[Rapscallion]

When you say "the church" do you mean the particular church in that town, the particular denomination for the church in that town, or all of Christianity? Because all of Christianity doesn't behave like that.

It's not my subsection of that particular voluntary grouping, so it's not me doing it?

Rapscallion

[AdminAssistant]

And, quite frankly, it's not a religious thing as much as it's cultural. My brother-in-law is not religious at all and he's very homophobic (and a bit racist). A hatred of "others" has become so ingrained in people and it's going to take a while to get over it. While fundamentalist churches fuel the fire, you'll find that a lot of these people hold these opinions because that's the way everyone around them thinks and they either don't want to stand out or they just don't know any better.

[BookstoreEscapee]

And nobody has a RIGHT to be a bigot.

I disagree. You have every right to be as bigoted as you like. What you don't have the right to do is legislate or otherwise officially enforce your bigotry. (Which is not to say it doesn't happen.) You can believe whatever you want.

I also have the right to think you're a complete asshole because of it.

[Nyoibo]

As someone said before if you don't want your beliefs tarred with the same brush as the bigoted sections then you need to stop being part of the "silent majority" who don't hold those beliefs. "All evil needs to triumph is for good men to do nothing" saying it's the minority responsible for the bad things means nothing if you stand by and let it happen, which seems to have been Smileys experiences.

[Greenday]

And if the Christian Church's stance on homosexuality is that it's wrong and you openly admit to following the Christian Church...why wouldn't the Church's stances reflect back on you?

[smileyeagle1021]

saying it's the minority responsible for the bad things means nothing if you stand by and let it happen, which seems to have been Smileys experiences.

exactly... I'm sorry, but you cannot say you oppose something and say it's just a minority and then stand by and do nothing... while you may not agree with it, if you do nothing it is clear that you don't disagree with it.

[KellyHabersham]

And, quite frankly, it's not a religious thing as much as it's cultural. My brother-in-law is not religious at all and he's very homophobic (and a bit racist). A hatred of "others" has become so ingrained in people and it's going to take a while to get over it. While fundamentalist churches fuel the fire, you'll find that a lot of these people hold these opinions because that's the way everyone around them thinks and they either don't want to stand out or they just don't know any better.

It's not just the fundamentalist churches who are like that......I've come across many so-called athiests and Satanists who were every bit as nasty/closed-minded/judgemental as fundamentalist Christians can be.

[Rapscallion]

And, quite frankly, it's not a religious thing as much as it's cultural. My brother-in-law is not religious at all and he's very homophobic (and a bit racist). A hatred of "others" has become so ingrained in people and it's going to take a while to get over it. While fundamentalist churches fuel the fire, you'll find that a lot of these people hold these opinions because that's the way everyone around them thinks and they either don't want to stand out or they just don't know any better.

Dunno, actually. Culture is a way of things handed down from your immediate ancestors. Religion is ... a way of things handed down generally from your immediate ancestors, though sometimes from outside sources. They're both shared values, beliefs, and common goals.

The difference is that religion provides justification for certain things, sometimes good and sometimes bad. This is generally based on what an invisible friend told some wild-eyed cave dweller in a far-off land, whereas cultural mores are based more on experiences of more local people.

I don't see much difference.

Rapscallion

[Boozy]

And, quite frankly, it's not a religious thing as much as it's cultural.

YES. Someone gets it.

AdminAssistant wins three internets!

I know a lot of Christians, many of whom support gay marriage, and NONE of whom would ever be so cruel to a gay teenager. Shit like that would get you ostracized in my neck of the woods.

Homophobes in Mississippi and Utah use Christianity to justify their bigotry. But they are not bigots because they are Christian.

As point of comparison: The 9/11 terrorists used Islam to justify their actions, but Islam did not cause them to do what they did.

We need to stop seeing these issues in such simplistic terms. It would be nice if bigotry were as easy to fix as switching churches, but it's not. We need to look at the bigger picture if we have any hope of treating the problem.

[Arcade Man D]

And if the Christian Church's stance on homosexuality is that it's wrong and you openly admit to following the Christian Church...why wouldn't the Church's stances reflect back on you?

Because there are so many different Christian Churches that, for example, the one I attend down't believe that homosexuality is wrong. In fact, there are entire highly populous sects that believe that homosexuality is an inborn quality, and is not sinful (so long as you're monogamous, but that goes for heterosexuals, too).

Saying that because some Christian churches teach that homosexuality is a sin, all of them do so, is like saying that because Wahabi Islam is virulently anti-American and supports the "70 virgins if you blow yourself up" stance, all of Islam does.

[telecom_goddess]

It's not just the fundamentalist churches who are like that......I've come across many so-called athiests and Satanists who were every bit as nasty/closed-minded/judgemental as fundamentalist Christians can be.

I'm an atheist and while I feel I can be closed minded on the group of christians that insist on trying to convert people and telling them how to live, I have respect for a lot of religions, the ancient ones that have amazing rituals. A lot of the catholic prayers are amazingly beautiful to listen to.

But ones that are newer and created for profit, and just get off on eliminating everything fun form someone's life...no I have no respect for those.

[KellyHabersham]

I'm an atheist and while I feel I can be closed minded on the group of christians that insist on trying to convert people and telling them how to live, I have respect for a lot of religions, the ancient ones that have amazing rituals. A lot of the catholic prayers are amazingly beautiful to listen to.

But ones that are newer and created for profit, and just get off on eliminating everything fun form someone's life...no I have no respect for those.

Oh, I definitely agree with you on much of that......when I'd made my initial post, I'd just been thinking of a bitchy woman whom I'd known from a music-related messageboard, and how she felt that since some Christians had persecuted those of her religious inclination, it meant she was entitled to be nasty and judgemental.