It's not babysitting

[DrFaroohk]

Saw this quote in an e-mail that said "it's not babysitting if you're taking care of your own kids." Meaning that guys who think they are "babysitting" their own kids are bastards.

Or how about you just appreciate the fact that he stuck around? He's at home, watching the kids, playing with them, feeding them, nurturing them, seeing to their every need, so you can go out and live your life, whether its working at a career or visiting friends and family or partying - and all you can do is whine like a six year old because he calls it babysitting?

How about you take a look around you, and see all the women who are just plain left alone - their husbands took off long ago - and probably because they whine like six year olds. Or even the ones whose guy stuck around for, they never get a day off because he refuses to watch the kids. I've seen this plenty of times. But oh no, that's not a problem. Yes, we've decided to target the worse offender of them all - the guys who stuck around, the guys who do their job, but refer to it as "babysitting". OMGZOR NOES!111!111!!1

Any time people bitch about stupid shit like this, I'm reminded of my school days - when if a student complained to the teacher about something like "Billy is LOOKING AT ME!!!!" and the teacher would say "Well you obviously don't have enough to do if you're so easily bothered by someone looking at you - here's extra homework". And it solved the problem pretty quick.

I think these unappreciative little slutbags don't have enough to do either. Since our help is so unwanted due to the nomenclature we might give it from time to time, fuck off and deal with it yourself for a while. Maybe "babysitting" will start sounding a whole lot better after you've been flying solo for a few months.

Amen.

[Arcade Man D]

Sorry, but it isn't babysitting if they're your kids, it's parenting.

"Babysit"
v.
1. The act of supervising another person's children for monetary or other compensation.

[DrFaroohk]

And I'm pretty sure most of the guys who are "babysitting" their kids didn't bother to consult a fucking dictionary. Most likely is that to him babysitting simply means looking after children, be it his or some ethiopian kid he found on the sidewalk.

It's not worth throwing a hissy fit and splitting hairs over. That's like people who say "I don't speak spanish, I speak mexican!" "I'm not English, I'm British!" "I'm not an American, I'm from Florida!" "I'm not babysiting, I'm parenting!"

Yay for stupid people!

[Hobbs]

Saw this quote in an e-mail that said "it's not babysitting if you're taking care of your own kids." Meaning that guys who think they are "babysitting" their own kids are bastards.


How do you get "bastard" out of that small fragment of a sentence? For that matter, what else did it say? Was that the only thing it said criticizing your parenting?

You seriously seem to have a stick up your six about any sort of criticism.

[DrFaroohk]

Only when its uncalled for. Yeah, I get defensive when I'm being attacked. Oh, people like to sugarcoat it and call it something else, but that's still what it is, plain and simple, being attacked, and I have every right to defend myself, my opinions and beliefs, my character, and everything else that has to do with me.

[Kimmik]

I have to agree with DrF heck I refer to it as babysitting when someone asks me where my hubby is. "He's at home babysitting squee" or "he's at home watching squee" I dont refer to it as parenting... to me babysitting is watching any child... yours or others... never been big on strict definitions...

I am happy when my hubby babysits our daughter,,, I get to have a nap or computer time...

[Hobbs]

Only when its uncalled for. Yeah, I get defensive when I'm being attacked. Oh, people like to sugarcoat it and call it something else, but that's still what it is, plain and simple, being attacked, and I have every right to defend myself, my opinions and beliefs, my character, and everything else that has to do with me.
I am simply debating with you. When I attack someone, that person'll know it.

That said...you didn't answer any of my inquiries.

[blas87]

See I always thought babysitting as something you got paid to do or were forced to do if you were the eldest child.

It'd be very old fashioned and weird to say "My husband is at home parenting the kids", so it's no biggie to say "He's watching the kids" or "He's at home with the kids".

[DrFaroohk]

But, but, but, "watching" means he's just looking at them! It implies nothing to do with caregiving at all!

That must mean he's not actually doing anything with them but observing! Neglect! Abuse! Waaaaah!

See what I mean? Doesn't it sound so stupid to argue over simple little wording when everyone knows what you mean?

[Hobbs]

Yes, it does sound stupid to argue over words, so why are you doing it?

[blas87]

Well, considering how some people go as far as to twist the written word, yes, you should watch yourself. Or quit caring what others think, I guess would be my best advice to you.

[Boozy]

Or how about you just appreciate the fact that he stuck around?...
How about you take a look around you, and see all the women who are just plain left alone - their husbands took off long ago - and probably because they whine like six year olds.

Do you want us to give you a medal?

It's not going to happen.

Refusing to abandon your offspring like a dog on the street is the bare minimum requirement of being a good human being.

I have to agree with DrF heck I refer to it as babysitting when someone asks me where my hubby is. "He's at home babysitting squee" or "he's at home watching squee" I dont refer to it as parenting... to me babysitting is watching any child... yours or others... never been big on strict definitions...

If your husband is out and about, and someone asks him where you and the baby are, does he say that you're "at home babysitting"? I'd bet my last dollar he does not.

There's a double-standard when it comes to childcare duties, and it's so engrained in our culture that we don't even think about it. Refusing to use the word "babysitting" when talking about a father and child when one would never do it when the child is with the mother....it's a small step, but an important one.

Language is important because it provides the framework for our thoughts and ideas. Change our language, change our thinking.

[Fashion Lad!]

Do you want us to give you a medal?

It's not going to happen.

Refusing to abandon your offspring like a dog on the street is the bare minimum requirement of being a good human being.



Thank you!!!!

Plenty of dads stick around and their children are no better off for it.

[powerboy]

DrF. I am glad that you are a father to the kids, but seriously take the stick out of your ass on this one. Some people says babysite and some calls it something else. I for one, would probably call it babysitting. But I would not whine like a 6 year old, when someone calls it something else.

[DrFaroohk]

That's exactly my point. The people who wrote the original thing and all the subsequent comments are the ones whining like six year olds because of a choice of words.

It's like when I say "It occurred to me that...." which is something I always say I guess, and rather than respond someone always says mockingly "Oh it OCCURRED to you? IT OCCURRED TO YOU? It OCCURRED? It OCCURRED!?!!? It...O...CCURRED? OCC....URRED!?!?!"

I jhust hate stupid people. I've lived with them all my life, and I despise them, and sometimes I wonder if I was put on this planet with the sole intention of purging them from existance forever.

[guywithashovel]

I can understand DrF's frustration on this. Most of the people who say "It's not babysitting if it's your own kids" are people who just want to demonize men.

And yes, it IS annoying when people constantly pick at people's words. For example, one time back in college, someone in my government class was talking about the 9/11 attacks, and while talking about it, he referred to the events as a tragedy. The instructor went off on that, saying that an attack on the country was NOT a tragedy but an "ACT OF WAR." Now what the heck was the difference? "Tragedy" and "Act of War" both represent bad things. There was also another time when someone I know was referring to being "aggravated" about something, and someone cut him off and said, "No, you're NOT 'aggravated,' you're 'IRRITATED.'" It's just petty.

[Nyoibo]

Language is important because it provides the framework for our thoughts and ideas. Change our language, change our thinking.

I'm going to debate that point... when I've had somesleep and can actually think straight.

[Fryk]

Not to mention the other side of this. When you call what the dad is doing 'babysitting', to me it cheapens what he's doing as a dad. Mom is RASING the kids. Dad? He's just "babysitting'.

[DrFaroohk]

Meanwhile, Junior just drowned in the bathtub because mom threw a hissy fit over dad calling it the B word.

[Rebel]

I'm very much against men using the term 'babysitting' when referring to their own children, but that's due to the Bastard in Law.

My sister married a guy that the rest of my family hates. We didn't start off hating him, but he soon proved himself less than scum in our eyes. How did he do this? By cheating on her 6 times and generally ignoring their young son.
-He would never change the boys nappy, instead he would wait for my sister to wake up or come home each day.
-He would never prepare their sons food.
-Until recently, he wouldn't even look after his own son by himself, someone always had to be with him.
He is an absolute Turd Donkey.

Just last week, my sister was going to go out for a night with her friends. She had organized this with TD 2 weeks in advance so he would stay home with their son. 2 hours before she was meant to go out, she rang my parents asking if they were free to babysit at all. Turns out TD had decided last minute that he wanted to go to the casino with his mates, so he told my sister he wouldn't be around to 'babysit'. My sister ended up having to cancel her plans and stay home.

While I'm sure you're a fantastic father DrFaroohk, there are absolute fucktards like TD out there that screw it up for everyone else.
That's why 'babysitting' can seen as an offensive word when said by the dad.

(don't ask me why she keeps taking him back, no-one knows)

[Ree]

It always pissed me off when it was referred to as babysitting when the father stayed home with the child.

It implies that childcare is the duty of the mother only, and the father is doing a favour by looking after the child.

Are you getting paid to look after the children?
NO.

Do you call is babusitting when the mother is with the children?
NO.

It's just fucking stupid to call it babysitting when it's actually PARENTING!!!

That's not attacking, nor criticizing, nor implying that anyone is a bastard if they refer to it as babysitting.

When our daughter was small, if I was out for an evening, people would say, "Is Daddy babysitting?"
I would say, "No, he's looking after our daughter at home."

[Kimmik]

Like I said I dont see a problem with calling it babysitting... after all he is sitting with the baby.. I also refer to it as watching, daddy time, and a few other words.. but never have I called it Parenting... as that is not something that you do off and on... and to be honest he watches Squee off and on.. as I am the primary care giver because of the hours he works.

He doesn't say I am at home raising the baby or parenting the baby... I am at home with or watching the baby.

Of course I am a feminists worse nightmare. I am very comfortable in the classic roles. Not to say that I can't do what a man can, but I prefer to be home with Squee and in the kitchen... which has caused my hubby grief... especially with his joke of shes at home doing women's work... He knows that there is nothing either of us do that the other cant... ok he cant cook,,, really he cant.

But to get bent out of shape about how the word babysitting is used is silly.. and by the by he does get paid to watch his daughter... lol he gets hubby points. Heck during this pregnancy I was babysat while hubby was at work as he worried I might fall down the stairs or have a problem.

ba·by·sit (bā'bē-sĭt')

v., -sat, also -sat (-săt'), -sit·ting, -sit·ing, -sits, -sits.

v.intr.

1. To take care of a child or children in the absence of a parent or guardian.
2. To take care of or watch over someone or something needing attention or guidance.

v.tr.

1. To provide care for (a child) in the absence of a parent or guardian.
2. To watch over or tend

[Ree]

ba·by·sit (bā'bē-sĭt')

v., -sat, also -sat (-săt'), -sit·ting, -sit·ing, -sits, -sits.

v.intr.

1. To take care of a child or children in the absence of a parent or guardian.
2. To take care of or watch over someone or something needing attention or guidance.

v.tr.

1. To provide care for (a child) in the absence of a parent or guardian.
2. To watch over or tendSo, if we take the first definition in each case, if the father is the parent, then there is no absence of a parent.

If we go by the second definition, then I guess you babysit your children too.

[Plaidman]

So, if we take the first definition in each case, if the father is the parent, then there is no absence of a parent.

If we go by the second definition, then I guess you babysit your children too.

Ahh, but remember, DrFaroohk makes it no secret to anyone at all, that he is merely the STEPfather. So he really isn't the parent in the biological sense. So technicaly, he does just /babysit/ them.


Not that he is a parent in any sense of my word of defination anyway.

[Hobbs]

Ahh, but remember, DrFaroohk makes it no secret to anyone at all, that he is merely the STEPfather. So he really isn't the parent in the biological sense. So technicaly, he does just /babysit/ them.


Not that he is a parent in any sense of my word of defination anyway.
Hua that, Plaid.

[Boozy]

Let's keep this on topic.

The debate is about using the word "babysitting" when talking about a parent watching a child. Any specific member's parenting skills are off the table for this thread, please.

[Ree]

Thanks, Boozy.

My comment wasn't directed at the OP anyway.
I was quoting Kimmik, so I was referring to her when I said she must babysit her children, too, if we take the word "babysitting" to mean <snip>
2. To take care of or watch over someone or something needing attention or guidance.
<snip>
2. To watch over or tend

[Boozy]

My comment wasn't directed at the OP anyway.

I know. And I'm sorry that your comment was used as an excuse to derail the thread into "personal attack" territory.

Back on topic, a response to Kimmik: No one's suggesting that you say, "My husband is at home parenting". That's ridiculous-sounding. I like Ree's suggestion -- "my husband is at home with our daughter".

Dictionary definitions aside, everyone knows that "babysitter" strongly implies a non-primary caregiver.

You never answered my question: When you are at home with your child, and someone calls and asks what you're doing, do you say, "I'm babysitting"?

Of course you don't.

And yet you use that term when describing what it is your husband is doing. That's an obvious double-standard.

Now, you have admitted that you're comfortable in so-called "classic" roles, so if you're okay with the double-standard, than I won't argue with that. To each their own. But surely you can admit that the double-standard exists?

[Kimmik]

If we go by the second definition, then I guess you babysit your children too.

yes hun i baby sit my daughter..or as my mother would say tending to my child. In my family the raising of children is a family affair. Everyone is responsible for the child's well being. My grandmother watched me and taught me to cook and various things, I was sent to my uncle he wasn't my parent but he helped raise me. I helped raise my cousins. So to me yes my husband babysits as do I especially when we give each other a night off to do personal things.

To me babysitting means nothing more then to watch or to tend. As I said a friend babysat me while I was pregnant to help ease my hubby's mind. And that is what we called it.. since my friend was watching over me. In my younger years I babysat friends that drank to much or did a little to much drugs.

I guess I am odd to think that it takes more then 2 people to raise a child. To me it takes a family *and that can and for me does include *adopted family**


You never answered my question: When you are at home with your child, and someone calls and asks what you're doing, do you say, "I'm babysitting"?


Actually I know this may sound odd but I do either use watching or tending and off and on babysitting... Normally I use babysitting if it is my night to stay in with Squee. Which is generally a night that hubby gets to have a few beers and kill things on one of the many consoles.

And technically if we wish to be pedantic... I am the primary caregiver because of my husbands hours. He might see his daughter for an hour on the days he works. I actually sat down with him and talked about this... and he is of the same mind about how he sees the word.

The way I was raised babysitting ment nothing more then to watch or tend... as in my family as I said previously raising a child is a family affair.

[Ree]

All of that is admirable, Kimmik, and I don't dispute the "it takes a whole family to raise a child" aspect.

What is being questioned is a double standard of implying that the mother tending to the child is just being the mother as if that is her role, but the father tending to the child is "babysitting", which, as Boozy has said, has traditionally meant "a non-primary caregiver".
It is saying that the mother is the primary caregiver, and the father's role is just to bring home the bacon and occasionally help out with the child if needed.

In some families, the mother does still stay home with the child while the father goes out to work. It seems to be that way in your family, Kimmik, and you seem content with that.
Times have changed a great deal, though, and I know many more families have both parents working outside the home.
It hardly seems fair to imply that the mother in that situation should be primarily responsible for looking after the children, while the father is relegated to the role of "babysitter".

In any case, unless the family dynamic really is that the father only tends to the children on an occasional basis as a last resort, I still think it seems silly to call it babysitting when the father looks after the child.

[LeChatNoir]

Right now, I am our son's primary caregiver. My husband works 4 days a week and goes to school 3 days a week. That said...I don't call it babysitting when my husband is with our son. If I am out and someone asks where Jacob is, I will say he's at home with Daddy, or he's spending time with him, or whatever. It's not babysitting. I'm not paying my husband to watch him. To me, babysitting implies that the person isn't obligated to care for the child, but is doing so because they are getting paid for it or are doing it as a favor to the parent. Alternately, I wouldn't say that my husband is home "parenting the baby" because to me the parenting part is a given. Parenting is so much more than meeting the basic biological needs of a child.

[Kimmik]

All of that is admirable, Kimmik, and I don't dispute the "it takes a whole family to raise a child" aspect.

<snip> as Boozy has said, has traditionally meant "a non-primary caregiver".
It is saying that the mother is the primary caregiver, and the father's role is just to bring home the bacon and occasionally help out with the child if needed.


Generally you have a primary care giver in any family. For us I am the primary care giver, as with hubby's hours he normally gets to give her a bottle and lay her back down. Though this week he has the pleasure of being the primary care giver.. and I babysat so he could go out. I have been sick this week and it has thankfully been his vacation... it is not to say that we are not there for each other.

How I was raised is the mothers were primarily responsible and the dads sat with the kids as needed. Mother was the primary caregiver and giver of punishment... Not to say the men didnt help... my dad taught me to shoot, to raise veggies, to fish, etc as did my mother. But in the care giver aspect it was Mom or my aunt etc..

I know some fathers that are the primary care givers... my husband babysits so that I can go to work on fri-sun between the hours of 6-5 normally I work about 6 hours.. He does this because he sleeps days as he is swing shift sorta. So all he does is change her feed her and lay her down... it is all that he can do. We are planning that when she gets a bit older i will stay home full time. But as it stands now he watches her on his nights off so I can go out.

To me if you watch a child so your partner can go out.. it is babysitting. Your staying home to sit with the child. But I can see where some might be offended as I have been told in the past that I am wrong for thinking my place is at home tending the household... but dang it that is what makes me happy... grrrr.

PS thanks for the merge Ree... I didnt even think about editing... sorry... stupid tummy head bug thingy of doom

[Ree]

I can see where some might be offended as I have been told in the past that I am wrong for thinking my place is at home tending the household... but dang it that is what makes me happy... grrrr.
Ummm...if you're happy with it, how can it be wrong?
Yes, by today's standards, it seems an outdated way of thinking, but it it works for you, then fine.
Who has the right to judge that?

I am certainly not judging.

It's personal preference, I guess.
I still don't feel that it's "babysitting" when the father takes care of the child, but in no way am I criticizing the way you raise your family or live your life.

[Hyena Dandy]

DrFahrook, before I formulate a reply, I want to make sure I have all the information. Was the ONLY thing the e-mail said "Its not babysitting if its your own kids" or was there more than that? Perhaps you could post the full text of the e-mail here?

If that was all there was to the e-mail, then I'd say it sounds like a chain e-mail, which is more in the vein of the people who are saying "The English Language is Declining!"

It may even have been on the level of gentle ribbing. Like how I send my friend dictionary and pronunciation guide entries because he pronounces 'breest' instead of 'breast' and 'bray' instead of 'bra'

I certainly doubt that anyone intended to hurt you by sending it, and I doubt anyone was saying that saying 'babysitting' is on the level of leaving your children completely. I suspect it was something that mildly annoyed the person who sent the e-mail at best.

From your history, though, it does make sense that you would be upset. After all, I can see how you would feel like you're being accused of being an absentee father simply over your word choice.

And while I'm not sure that it ENTIRELY fits in this case, I am just as upset as anyone else over the implication that people make, that fathers are insensitive, or don't care enough for their children, or don't know how to manage children, or something like that. That for me is something which upsets me, because I know I was raised a great deal by my father, and he's always been a roll model to me, as I hope to be to my child one day. And he was never absentee in any way.

[Plaidman]

From your history, though, it does make sense that you would be upset. After all, I can see how you would feel like you're being accused of being an absentee father simply over your word choice.

And while I'm not sure that it ENTIRELY fits in this case, I am just as upset as anyone else over the implication that people make, that fathers are insensitive, or don't care enough for their children, or don't know how to manage children, or something like that. That for me is something which upsets me, because I know I was raised a great deal by my father, and he's always been a roll model to me, as I hope to be to my child one day. And he was never absentee in any way.

No kidding he be upset. It isn't his kids. He wants to be smoking weed and playing video games rather then parent the kids. But since it's in his eye sight, he technically watching them.

[Hobbs]

Plaid, not entirely sure what you're getting at that.

[Wingates_Hellsing]

No kidding he be upset. It isn't his kids. He wants to be smoking weed and playing video games rather then parent the kids. But since it's in his eye sight, he technically watching them.

Yeah, all because he refers to it as babysitting... chalk up another win for logic on that one.

Seriously though, it's gotten to the point where Dr. F is practically nailed to a cross, for as we all know, if one finds themselves in a position where they're expected to take care of children they never wanted and who constantly pose a significant legal threat, they're not only supposed to give up all of their earthly wants and desires, they have to like it. Seems to me we're short on people who measure up to what we would consider required, seems to me that, if we want more, we shouldn't call them assholes because they aren't shooting for the purple heart and a stay in the state penitentiary compliments fibbing brats.

[Ree]

It has already been said that this thread should not become a condemnation of DrF's parenting.

We are all well aware of his situation. Forgive us if we don't think it's grounds for a medal to just be a decent human being and help to raise the children that come as part of the relationship one has chosen to enter into.
Unless someone has a gun to one's head, if a person really does not want to be a parent, then they should be honest from the start and not marry someone who already has children.
While I know a lot of the posts he has made here are just venting, it's very hard to have sympathy for someone who willingly went into the situation and then complains about it after.

This thread was a discussion of the double standard for using the term "babysitter" when the father is looking after the child.

He objected to something on that topic in an email, and felt it was an insult directed at him.

That should be the focus of the thread.

Any more slams and critcisms of his parenting skills will be considered a personal insult and an infraction will be issued.

[boringscreenname]

We don't use the term baby-sitting in our household, unless someone other than my husband or I is caring for our son. I see both of our roles as equal.

Actually lately my husband has been taking on the primary caregiver role, because his hours at work have been drastically cut, whereas I'm still working 40 hours a week. It's not a big deal to us, our son is with either one of us at all times, and we try to split things up as evenly as possible.

People are somewhat surprised when they find out that my husband stays at home, while I'm working. I don't know why it's such a foreign concept to people. Actually we set up our schedules that way intentionally so that we don't have to pay for daycare costs, and so that our son and future children are always home with one of us. It works out well for us, and if anything has made my husbsand a more competent and confident father, because he's been taking care of our son from the minute he's born and he knows how to handle everything from how to handle the bed time routine, to temper tantrums.

[Red Panda]

The term babysitting implies the person babysitting doesn't normally watch the child. You don't say a stay at home mom babysits every day do you? A dad doesn't babysit unless for whatever reason he is not part of the day to day raising of the child. A father should want to not be considered a babysitter because it means he is involved with the child's life so much that watching the child is nothing special.