Laws that you don't follow

[Scottya21]

There are lots of laws that nobody actually pays any attention to . Speeding limits on the highways. Smoking laws in some cases. OSHA ( especially material safety data sheets for stuff you bought at the store down the street). There are laws here, but people don't follow them. And they never get called on it by the authorities.

What's going on with this? Is it right? Does it depend on the specific offense? Does it have anything to do with whether the law itself is a good law? How about all those ancient laws that noone bothers to take off the books? (in a town where I lived, "horseless carriages" were illegal. :rolleyes: )

Discuss!

[MadMike]

I feel that it's not illegal if it doesn't hurt anyone, and you don't get caught. ;)

[rahmota]

And as long as its between CONSENTING ADULTS who are willing and ready to accept the consequences of their actions then its all good.


Sorry about using the god voice but those two words are vitally important in this discussion.

[BusBus]

I jaywalk on occasion. I only do it if the coast is clear and there are no obvious cop cars around. I don't expect traffic to come to a halt because I am too lazy to walk 300m to the nearest crosswalk (I refuse to stop for jaywalkers when I'm driving).

[blas87]

I carry a knife and pepperspray on me. While it's not illegal to sell those items, if I were to get pulled over, both would be taken and I'd probably be up shit crick. Even if a guy attacked me and I peppersprayed him, he'd sue me and you know who'd win...

[rahmota]

Blas: Hmm thats interesting because around here (very rural part of SW ohio) CS Spray and Knives are allowed to be openly carried. I know because I carry a small canister of CS on my bike to deal with dogs and usually have a small (3" blade) on my belt to deal with other stuff and asked the sheriff about it to be sure.

Heck during deer season we have people walking down the street with all kinds of hardware on them and the cops don't say a thing about it unles syou are being stupid or something retarded about it.

[blas87]

I have never understood it either, but everyone I know that has ever been pulled over or searched by a cop has had their pepperspray and their knives taken away. Not just pulled aside by the policeman/woman for his/her own protection, but taken away completely. Not always does a "concealed weapon" fine ensue for the knife, it depends which cop you get and what mood he/she is in. But yes, very illegal around here unless it's hunting season. They recommend women carry pepperspray yet take it away from them.

Oh well, I'd just go back and get another bottle and another knife. It's not like I spray people for fun or I'm pretending to be Jason with a maschete....it's just a little knife!

[protege]

Quite a few people here have pepper spray. I have a small can I keep in the car--I drive through some unsafe areas to/from work, and even though I've never used it, I'd rather be safe than sorry.

In rural areas, many people are armed. Doesn't stop idiots from trying to break into houses though--usually not a good idea when some homeowners will shoot first and ask questions later!

[rahmota]

Blas: I'm sorry to hear that. That sounds downright stupidly wrong of the authorities in your area.

Protege: Yeah definately agree on that about the smith and wesson home invasion protection plan. I am one of those types. We have had someone out messing with the out buildings and a round or two (.22LR) into the ground nearby was quite motivational to cease messing. Not an uncommon condition. One of the reason that if you approach a person's house in the country make sure they get a good look at you and announce yourself so it dont look like you're sneaking up on them.

[blas87]

I might as well add when I first moved in (my roomate is a very big 2nd amendment fan and has his own artillery lol) my roomate told me that he left a loaded pistol under the couch for emergencies. Just in case I felt someone was breaking in. The first month I lived here I did take the gun outside with me when I left in the middle of the night on weekends.

Right around late September, my roomate's gf's car and his truck got broken into (she lives in a much worse neighborhood). Actually, almost any car parked on that street got broken into or attempted a few times, all within days of each other. Considering my roomate's gf has a baby, and my roomate doesn't tolerate theft or suspicious folk........he took the gun back. Fine with me. I just hope he never has to use it.

[squall]

I'd like to try a Cuban cigar.....I missed my chance when I went to Mexico and got too drunk.I believe that after Castro dies, an open door policy should begin with Cuba, allowing tourism and trade. It is a beautiful country mired by a communist dictator. It's only illegal to have Cuban cigars because JFK declared a trade embargo. That embargo is a little too dated now for anyone to give a hoot anymore.

[Ryu]

only problem is once castro dies his brother is expected to take over so things might not change
as far as travel goes, thats not on our side thats cuba
my professer was telling us about her friend who got stuck in cuba after deciding to visit it on his way home from some south american country

[Will-Mun]

The only law I knowingly and completely disregard? Pretty much every Anti-Piracy law related to digital media. The RIAA and MPAA can suck my co-... Finger!

But yeah, I download movies, songs, entire seasons of of television shows. But I'm broke! And can't afford the real stuff. :D

That and the RIAA and MPAA are such Nazi's about anti-piracy, they're making the legal stuff too much of a hassle to buy anyway!


Oh, and I LOVE to slurp soup... :p

(Look up unenforced New Jersey laws.)

[MadMike]

The only law I knowingly and completely disregard? Pretty much every Anti-Piracy law related to digital media. The RIAA and MPAA can suck my co-... Finger!


Agreed, although I prefer to buy it if I can. Trying to find something for download is a pain in the ass.

The only stuff I download is:

1. Unreleased rare demos (the industry isn't losing out on money if they're not selling it.)

2. Out of print material (see #1.)

3. Tracks that were released on a non-US version of what I already purchased (I'll be damned if I'm going to buy the same thing twice.)

4. Bonus tracks on re-releases of what I already purchased (see #3.)

Also, some of you may have seen my thread in the Tech Help forum of CS where I wanted help building a media center PC. Technically, what I want to do is not 100% legal, as I'm bypassing the copy protection to copy my DVDs onto the server I'm building. It's perfectly legal under Fair Use, which has been around for a couple decades, but illegal under the recently-enacted DMCA. Since I'm only copying them for my own use in my own house, and so I have all my movies at my fingertips and don't have to worry about wear and tear on this discs, and I'm not making copies to give out, the MPAA can bite my shiny metal ass. :D

[NightAngel]

There is a law in my city that you cannot smoke within 25 feet of any building...

Yeah... sure. :rolleyes:

Guess how many people obey that law?

[DGoddess]

There is a law in my city that you cannot smoke within 25 feet of any building...

Yeah... sure. :rolleyes:

Guess how many people obey that law?

Wanna know what I have to say on that one?

*lights up cigarette and blows puff of smoke into direction of NA's town*

Frankly, I think these smoking laws are rather hypocritical.

Look at it this way: tobacco is legal, our government gets so much money from taxes every year, our elected officials get money from special interest groups (one of which I'm sure has to do with tobacco) yet they want to restrict where people smoke.

Give me a break and a light:D

[Greenday]

Well, I consume alcohol even though I'm under 21. Always thought that law sucked.

I too download music for nothing.

I pour hazardous chemicals down the sink without properly neutralizing them.

[Nightwolf]

I probably do more than I know about...but the one I have the biggest beef with is the seatbelt law.

I don't understand WHY this has to be a law. It saves lives......maybe. I've seen a good amount of people die from wearing their seatbelt too and someone saying, "had they not been wearing it, they probably would have lived."

I just think it's stupid. To me it's more of personal choice than a reason to be a law. I never wear my seat belt, and I've got 9 violations that support that. lol.

All of the reasons I was pulled over are bullcrap too. We saw your car and it matches the description of a car thats wanted in this area.......sure. Oh by the way, I noticed you're not wearing your seatbelt. writes up ticket

Did you know your plates are expired? (you saw that from sitting at your speed trap did ya?) Oh, and you're not wearing your seatbelt. writes up ticket

[Greenday]

Nightwolf, just be glad you don't live in NJ then. You can actually be pulled over for not wearing your seatbelt. It's now a primary offense.

[rahmota]

I'll agree that it should be personal choice to wear or not wear a seatbelt or any life saving device. Of course that also waves societies responsibility for helping pick your butt up off the pavement too. Taking responsibility for your own life is all fine and good but you have to be willing to take ALL the remification of it.

That said I gotta say ticketing someone for it is just another way for the govt to take money from people.

[Greenday]

That said I gotta say ticketing someone for it is just another way for the govt to take money from people.

I suppose they could raise taxes a lil bit to make up all the money they'd lose if they stopped ticketing for that offense.

Is it really that hard to buckle up though? I mean, it only takes a couple seconds. You are more likely to survive a car crash if you are wearing one.

As rahmota also pointed out in his post, someone has to clean up the mess. That's one person who has to deal with it. The other person involved in the accident will forever have it on their mind. Any family of the deceased will have to deal with the pain from the loss of the deceased. Starting to add up on those affected.

Honestly, not buckling up just goes under laziness in my book.

[CancelMyService]

I just find it baffling that people need to be told to wear a device that can save your life in the event the several tons of steel you're traveling 30-70 MPH in might come to a sudden and unexpected stop.

Same thing with helmet laws. I can't figure out why someone would NOT wear one unless they want to be a rebel and don't want the man telling them what to do.

Also, I always hear it mentioned by anti-seatbelt people but I've never heard of someone dying in an accident where it would have saved their life not to wear one. I mean, I'm sure it's happened, but I don't think it happens at the rate where it becomes a good argument to repeal laws.

[rahmota]

Greenday:As rahmota also pointed out in her post *sigh* Not on the web too now? Nothign upsetting or personal I just want to point out that the last time I checked I was male. Sorry for any confusion there. And the not the net too comment is because I have a feminine sounding voice over the radio or so I've been told before. Especially when using the CB and lonely truckers hit on me....

Now as to the helmet/belt laws. I never said it was a stupid idea not to follow them just a person's choice and right to do with their body as they wish to do with it. Just if they are goig to do something stupid like that or free climb el capitain or try and ski down a cliff during an avalanche they should be prepared to accept all the results of that. Physically, emotionally, financially and worldly.

Physically the pain of smacking into somethign at several hundred psi, emotionally of going from hale and hearty to innjured and possibly crippled for life, financially well we dont even need to talk about that one, and worldly as in the effect they will have on others.

As for not wearing a helmet I must admit I'm rather guilty of that as I wear glasses and its hard to find a good fitting helmet that doesnt scrunch or mess with my glasses. Most of the time when I have to wear a helmet on a dirt bike I wear my old steel pot army helmet. If I do get to get my own motorcycle (instead of bumming rides on others) I plan on getting an open face which is a nice compromise at least. But then I am fully and totally prepared to accept the consequences of my actions too.

And as for the not wearing seatbelts save lives stories I can think of three right off the top of my head. I can also think of about triple digits of seat belts saved lives stories. So yeah that ratio is not really strong enough to be the cause to repeal the belt laws and such. Personal freedom/liberty/responsibility is a much firmer (if that can be said in regards to this) basis to discus it on.

And the three stories 1 involved an individual who rolled a convertable and got thrown clear and lived. 1 Involved a person who got ejected from the vehicle which hit an abutment and sheared the roof off including the top of the seat. 1 involved a person who was riding in the back of a jeep that got t-boned by a speeding semi. the person in the back got thrown clear while the front two died.

[AFPheonix]

My Shoei full face is comfy to wear with sunglasses, it doesn't ride down on them at all.

I'm of the opinion that if you choose not to wear a seatbelt or a helmet and get plastered across the highway, that the general populace should not be required to pay for your hospital stay in the event that you don't have insurance.

We should not have to pay for other people's stupidity.

[Greenday]

Damnit, sorry about that rahmota. I blame my Spanish classes. In Spanish, it seems like everything that is the feminine version ends with an a. My bad. Fixed it.

[Boozy]

Damnit, sorry about that rahmota. I blame my Spanish classes. In Spanish, it seems like everything that is the feminine version ends with an a. My bad. Fixed it.

Hey, don't feel so bad. rahmota mistook me for a guy. ;)

[rahmota]

Sorry about that everyone. Oh well you live you learn... :) At least it didnt happen at a swing party like that. That could have been a bit embarressing :p

AFP: I've tried several shoei and some other brands and full faces all ride my prescription galsses into my nose or bend the temples in so that I get blurred vision and have to bend the glasses back into place afterwards. And this is from just trying them on in the store or riding with them at a friend's place.

[AFPheonix]

Hmm....wierd.

How about one of the HJC flip front ones? My brother has one, it's really light, too, and you can flip the whole front of the helmet up so it's easier to snack :)

http://www.hjchelmets.com/clmax.htm

[rahmota]

AFP: Hmm no I havent tried one of those. Mainly for a couple reasons. 1 The local dirt bike shop doesnt carry any in stock and since I'm not in the market (because I'm too broke to afforda bike or gear of my own) in depth yet I've not looked overly hard. But the ones I hav etried in several sizes dont fit right, maybe its my head or something but I'll definately try and find one that works good for me when I get the money ahead to get my own bike....Assuming the dock dont rot before that boat comes in...

[AFPheonix]

Maybe you just have a weird head ;)

I prefer the full face helmets because I hate getting road dirt embedded in my skin. And bugs freaking HURT when they hit your face at freeway speeds.

Well....that and not having my face ground off in the event I have an unplanned dismount is a plus, too ;)

[Greenday]

And bugs freaking HURT when they hit your face at freeway speeds.

That, and bugs taste nasty as hell.

[Nightwolf]

someone has to clean up the mess. That's one person who has to deal with it. The other person involved in the accident will forever have it on their mind. Any family of the deceased will have to deal with the pain from the loss of the deceased. Starting to add up on those affected.

Honestly, not buckling up just goes under laziness in my book.


Mkay, but, people have to deal with the cleanup and sights no matter how it goes so i'm not sure how that would waive societies right. Died/injured with belt, died/injured without. Same thing with any loss from any accident at all.

Really has nothing to do with being lazy, I just find it uncomfortable and annoying to wear.

I think they did finally pass it so that you can be pulled over for not wearing your seatbelt now in WI.

I did go for a while where I was wearing it, but most of the time I'd hop in the car and I'd just forget. Bout half way home I'd realize, oh yeah, Seatbelt.

[powerboy]

I probably do more than I know about...but the one I have the biggest beef with is the seatbelt law.

I don't understand WHY this has to be a law. It saves lives......maybe.


Hell Fucking yeah it saves lives. I crashed 2 times in my life. Once when I was younger, and once about 2 years back. luckily for me, I had the seatbelt on. I still think that it is stupid for having to wear them, but I will gladly wear it everytime.

[protege]

I always wear my seatbelt. Too much at stake not to.

My father is lucky to be alive because of his seatbelt. For years, he never wore one...simply because when he was growing up, nobody did. Anyway, he got hit back in '93, and was lucky to have put it on. Some idiot in a 1970s Pontiac broadsides him as he was pulling out of a parallel space. The Pontiac slammed into my '87 Ford Tempo, tossing it about 40 feet :eek: When it was all over, witnesses said they saw my father's head snap back, and thought he was dead :eek: The impact took out the driver's door, window, knocked off both mirrors, slightly bent the frame... If he hadn't worn his belt that day, he would have gone right out the passenger window, and probably into one of the trees lining the street :(

[ArenaBoy]

A seatbelt just about saved my life a few weeks ago. I was at a family's place out in the boonies, they had a go-kart track set up and one of the go-karts went a bit faster than the ones set out. My cousin and I went for a few laps on the faster one, on the 3rd lap we hit a rock and managed to roll over 3-5 times according to his dad. We were lucky to even walk away with the scrapes we had. I was in the passenger side and I was being suspended in the air. My uncle who happens to be a cop said that we were damn lucky to be alive because of the roll bar and the seat belt.

Believe me when I say that it's a lot of work for the police to fill out the paperwork for a death or a severe injury just because someone didn't wear their seatbelt. Really it's a safety thing and it's sad that the police have to use these sort of things just to encourage people to be safer.


I don't understand WHY this has to be a law. It saves lives......maybe. I've seen a good amount of people die from wearing their seatbelt too and someone saying, "had they not been wearing it, they probably would have lived."


Wearing a seatbelt doesn't guarantee that you will live but it can increase your chances . It also depends on the severity of the accident. A seatbelt doesn't have the magical power of casting a shield but it does and it can increase your chances of survival and I'd rather play that card.

[squall]

There is nothing safe about flying through the windshield of your car. The impact through the window can kill you, let alone whatever is on the outside whether it be pavement, trees, or moving vehicles. The bit about living if they had been thrown from the vehicle as opposed to staying in is the exception, not the norm. If I'm going to take my chances either way, chances are I stand a better chance of survival strapped to my seat.

[rahmota]

That, and bugs taste nasty as hell.
Depends on the bug and how you eat them.......

QAnd yeah I wear a belt 99% of the time. usually if I'm doing somethign on the farm that I have to get in and out of the truck more than a couple times or just goign across the field then nah. That is unless I'm mudding then i strap in as I've been upside down a few times too many. Highways and on road always ,always though.

I don't understand WHY this has to be a law. It saves lives......maybe. I've seen a good amount of people die from wearing their seatbelt too and someone saying, "had they not been wearing it, they probably would have lived."

Like I said earlier I only know of 3 events where not wearing the belt saved their lives and would probably have died if they had been in the car. I know of litterally probably a hundred or so times where the belt saved someone's life. Not a good ratio for the seatbelt less idea. Think of it this way. Why do NASCAR drivers all wear five point harness among their gear? Even the most lowly redneck dirt track racer has at least the factory belts in it.