Tolerance

[Andara Bledin]

When we first patronized CFA, we were like most of their customers; we knew they were ostensibly "Christian" but mostly that just meant we couldn't eat there on a Sunday.

However, we have a friend that is gay who knew more about them; and while she didn't object to us eating there, she chose not to patronize them. Once we had more info, we also chose to eat elsewhere.

As with her, we won't begrudge others their own choice in this matter, but we've made ours.

^-.-^

[BlaqueKatt]

I'm thinking it wouldn't be too hard to lie on the paperwork.

know how I know you didn't read the article? It would take a lot more than just "lying on the paperwork

They screen prospective operators for their loyalty, wholesome values and willingness to buy into Chick-fil-A's in-your-face Christian credo, espoused often by Cathy, an evangelical Southern Baptist who says "the Lord has never spoken to me, but I feel Chick-fil-A has been His gift."
Loyalty to the company isn't the only thing that matters to Cathy, who wants married workers, believing they are more industrious and productive. One in three company operators have attended Christian-based relationship-building retreats through WinShape at Berry College in Mount Berry, Ga. The programs include classes on conflict resolution and communication. Family members of prospective operators--children, even--are frequently interviewed so Cathy and his family can learn more about job candidates and their relationships at home. "If a man can't manage his own life, he can't manage a business," says Cathy, who says he would probably fire an employee or terminate an operator who "has been sinful or done something harmful to their family members."

The parent company asks people who apply for an operator license to disclose marital status, number of dependents and involvement in "community, civic, social, church and/or professional organizations."

But Danielle Alderson, 30, a Baltimore operator, says some fellow franchisees find that Chick-fil-A butts into its workers' personal lives a bit much. She says she can't hire a good manager who, say, moonlights at a strip club because it would irk the company. "We are watched very closely by Chick-fil-A," she says. "It's very weird." Many Chick-fil-A job candidates must endure a yearlong vetting process that includes dozens of interviews. Ty Yokum, the training manager for the chain, sat through 7 interviews and didn't get the job. He reapplied in 1991 and was subjected to another 17 interviews--the final one lasted five hours--and was hired

[Crazedclerkthe2nd]

this is actually correct for CFA-in order to get a franchise you have to agree to and prove you believe the same as CFA'a founder, or you don't get a franchise, they only hire people that believe the same.

I posted this in the other thread but it got buried.
history of chick fil-A-forbes likens it to a cult.

I'm thinking it wouldn't be too hard to lie on the paperwork.

[lupo pazzesco]

The whole blowup on Facebook and the internet has been interesting to follow, with people up in arms and screaming from behind their keyboards. I, personally, rarely go to Chick-fil-A. Now that know where they stand, and that the man in charge actively donates to anti-gay groups? Meh, it's chicken fried in peanut oil. I can - and have - replicate that in my own kitchen, should I wish to. Further, after reading BlaqueKatt's links, I'm even less inclined to patronize a company that digs so invasively into my private life, given that I, personally, believe in separating my personal life from my work life. I don't go to church on Sundays, that shouldn't have anything to do with my ability to cook fried chicken or provide customer service. Really, it shouldn't. Nor should my history of volunteering, if any.

I know that I'm not the only one who feels this way, and I'm also seeing a lot of posts in my FB feed about people going "it's just CHICKEN, GET OVER IT!" but I can't. I don't shop at wal-mart because of personal beliefs and ideological differences over how they treat their employees. I don't buy from companies that use practices I don't believe in, either. Why would I eat chicken from a company that's so loudly come out on the side of quashing personal freedom?

I've been skimming some of the links and found This I think it sums up my feelings on the matter far more eloquently than I ever could. smileyeagle, hyena dandy, I think you'd appreciate the article as well. It's brilliant and ariticulate and very well written.

And, well, that's my say on the matter, I guess.

[BlaqueKatt]

Also..people are confusing the policy of the person in charge with the people in the chain of command..don't WE (those who are members of CS.COM that is) normally take umbrage at when people put management policies on us?

this is actually correct for CFA-in order to get a franchise you have to agree to and prove you believe the same as CFA'a founder, or you don't get a franchise, they only hire people that believe the same.

I posted this in the other thread but it got buried.
history of chick fil-A-forbes likens it to a cult.

[Crazedclerkthe2nd]

The only thing more deafening in this debate than Chick-Fil-A and their Christian supporters defending them, is the absolute and utter silence from Christians opposing them... I have heard absolutely zero people opposing them because of their Christianity, the closest I've come is people opposing them in spite of their Christianity. And then those Christians who do oppose inequality shake their heads in sorrow asking why everyone thinks that Christians are bigots.

I think that's because the views of Chick-Fil-A are largely in line with a majority of Christians in the United States. Of the Christians I've met, their opinions/beliefs on homosexuality vary widely but every last one of them fully believes that being gay is a sin and that a person cannot possibly be both gay AND Christian at the same time.
(NOTE: I know not ALL Christians feel the same, I'm simply using my own personal observations as an example here)

Now personally, as a Christian myself, I choose to live my life based upon Jesus' greatest command which was: Love one another.

That means I treat everyone with the same respect, dignity and care regardless of who they are.

I work with a couple of lesbians and I do not evangelize to them or try to get them to "convert" (to being straight that is). I do not lie about my faith when asked about it, but I certainly don't give them extra grief because of their lifestyle choices.

I've never understood why Christians feel that being disrespectful and degrading to gay people will somehow magically get them to renounce homosexuality and run to the arms of Jesus.

In fact, it accomplishes nothing except the exact opposite.

[HYHYBT]

I've known for a long time about the anti-gay-marriage thing with Chik-Fil-A and have still very happily sucked down their milkshakes for years. (Their chicken though? Ugh.) Once I found out that they were actively donating to groups who want to limit the civil rights of others based on who they sleep with, I started getting my milkshake fix from Steak n Shake instead.

Other than very much liking their chicken (and having neither a Steak n Shake nor a KFC locally) I'm pretty much there too. That they were philosophically opposed, and even that they held marriage retreats and such open only to opposite-sex couples, was saddening, but it's their business (so to speak) and not *hurting* anybody; just a matter of supporting some and not others. But when it came out they give money to sheer evil like AFA and FRC, that's a whole new situation.

[ngc_7331]

I've known for a long time about the anti-gay-marriage thing with Chik-Fil-A and have still very happily sucked down their milkshakes for years. (Their chicken though? Ugh.) Once I found out that they were actively donating to groups who want to limit the civil rights of others based on who they sleep with, I started getting my milkshake fix from Steak n Shake instead. For me, it's the difference between someone threatening to punch me and someone actually taking a swing. One's gonna get you laughed at and the other one's gonna get you a busted nose.

[Gravekeeper]

I believe that one of the main issues is that the owner of Chik-Fil-A is willing to give ungodly amounts of money to groups who oppose gay marriage. It's perfectly fine for him to have his own opinion, but the fact that he garners a lot of money and power is frightening.

Yes, which is why framing this as a matter of free speech or a political viewpoint is, in my opinion, completely incorrect. This man is using his company to fund a suppression of human rights. That goes beyond him having an opinion or political viewpoint.

[Seifer]

I believe that one of the main issues is that the owner of Chik-Fil-A is willing to give ungodly amounts of money to groups who oppose gay marriage. It's perfectly fine for him to have his own opinion, but the fact that he garners a lot of money and power is frightening. The way I see it? If you don't want your money going toward an anti-gay marriage group, then don't give Chik-Fil-A your money.

[Hyena Dandy]

and again, you can fully support someone's right to say what they want, AND still call them a douche. being respectful of free speech doesnt mean you have to lose your own voice.

Also, so they're douches. There's a lot of douches in the world, and I quite simply lack the time or energy to yell at ALL of them. Only so many hours in a day.

The thing about tolerating is also that, well, in this case it's NOT just a case of 'not tolerating someone's opinion.'

When money changes hands, it stops being an opinion, and starts being an attack. And when someone donates $2,000,000 to groups that say that I shouldn't have the same legal rights as everyone else... That is worth getting angry about.

[siead_lietrathua]

i dont care if people think i'm trying to be better than them, and i dont care if it turns into an argument.
if someone is a jerk, i'ma call them a jerk. that simple. if others see that as stooping to their level, that's their freedom to preceive. but i'm jsut saying what i think.

and again, you can fully support someone's right to say what they want, AND still call them a douche. being respectful of free speech doesnt mean you have to lose your own voice.

besides, free speech protects you from the government anyway. not from other citizens.

[Mytical]

I have been given some deep food for thought on this. I do like to get all sides to an issue, to make a very informed decision. Leads to a very open mind about things, and incredible tolerance, but maybe I am too tolerant. Because a lot of things said makes sense. I support anybody's right to say whatever they want, even if I think it is the stupidest/craziest/most insane thing in the world.

One thing I do want is for people to stop and think about things. When you answer hate filled words, with hate filled words, are you really any better then the person who you are angry at? If they bring you down to their level, even if you win the 'argument', they win. The best revenge is to answer hate filled words, with words of love and tolerance. Will drive them crazy. Doesn't matter 'who started it', somebody has to be the bigger person. Will it be you..or will it be them. Chose fast.

[Hyena Dandy]

The only thing more deafening in this debate than Chick-Fil-A and their Christian supporters defending them, is the absolute and utter silence from Christians opposing them... I have heard absolutely zero people opposing them because of their Christianity, the closest I've come is people opposing them in spite of their Christianity.

What?

How many Christians on here have said "Well, I believe that gays are immoral, BUT..."

No, we haven't said "Because my faith says" but do you expect Christians to say "Because of my faith, I believe that..." Before every sentence before you accept that Christianity doesn't object to it?

I believe in equal treatment for all people. I believe this supported by my faith. But I don't have to say "Because I'm a Christian, I think" EVERY time I think something related to my faith.

I'm sick of this. First I'm told Christians don't support gay people. When I can show that they do, I'm told they're not REAL Christians. Now that I Can show that they are, it still doesn't count because I'm not saying Jesus every other word.

[siead_lietrathua]

plus i find a huge diffrence in not tolerating someone because of their gender, skin colour, religion, or sexual orientation VS not tolerating someone because they can't keep their opinions to themselves.
noone really gives a fuck that the guy is christian. it's where he is putting his mouth and his money that matters.

it's kinda like running through Harlem hollering about how black people should all be slaves and other racial slurs. do you have the right to say it? sure. are you probably gonna get shot for it? yyup.