College Rants

[Depot Denizen]

I'm a 5th year senior at UVM in Vermont. I started taking classes at the CC of VT half a year after I got out of highschool, I was already working 2nd shift at a fulltime job at Dartmouth at the time. A year and a half later I gave up my decently paying job (I was doing computer ops in the server room, nothing grand but I got to hang out with the sys admins all day when they were there) to go to my 4-year uni.

I've never been a model student. There have been a few subjects and classes I've excelled at, and others that I just had a horrible time with. My first year was challenging even though I wasn't working, and I ended up picking up a job doing tech support for the uni that following fall.

Before I know it I'm working ~40 hours a week at the helpline doing IT support for staff/faculty/students/emeriti, and juggling 12-16 credits a semester. It sucked, but I had to stick with it. More than a few times I thought about throwing in the towel and begging for my old job back. I failed a few classes and learned some lessons, and now I'm less than three months from my B.A. in Computer Science. Whoopee.

Now, I'm working a full-time job at the hospital doing IT support on graveyard shift (That's right folks, 8pm-6am) and taking ten credits. I could have taken more, but I'm already stretched out thin. I've persevered and despite all of my setbacks I'm making more than most of my friends combined. I'm also saddled with $100,000 in student loans, but that'll be paid off eventually.

Lessons learned: be the prof's friend. Approach the prof and give the prof offerings. It will appease the prof. Try to be on-time and offer input when called on. This too, will appease the prof and make the prof's light shine upon you. Ask questions when appropriate, for the prof will bestow much wisdom. And if you think you're in over your head: talk to the prof, for they may grant you amnesty and guidance.

Despite my experiences at college, I know I'm going to get bored after next summer and I'll probably go after my Master's in CS or something else. I really want to get into robotics, I had a very good experience with a hands-on class I took with it. I'd like to try my hand at teaching as well. But for now my focus is on surviving undergrad and 3rd shift.

I actually liked my GE classes. I had a lot of fun with anthro and Greek writings, and I aced psychology. I ended up taking Japanese to see what it was like...and now I'm a fourth-year Japanese minor as well. I was originally Physics and Poli Sci until I got my ass handed to me by the physics class and realized I was barking up the wrong tree. Don't be afraid to change majors, unless you're dead set on it. Hell, there's no shame in having to take an extra year for your classes.

I wasn't one of the studious students who earned a scholarship or tons of grants - and you guys rock, seriously. If you can get those 4.0s then keep it up. My girlfriend is one of those smart, talented people who works hard and does really well. Her loan amount is piddly for the effort she's put in. The only thing I ask is to not put everyone else down, and most of you guys are good about that. Unfortunately $20k a year hasn't been friendly to me...but knowing what I do now, I probably would have done a lot better as an undergrad.

[Rageaholic]

I agree with that. Oh, it's supposed to make us well rounded. That's cool, but I can get by just fine without knowing the philosophies of people from a few thousand years, basic writing (learned that awhile ago), history (learned more history than an intro class can teach me), politics of diversity, sociology, etc. etc. I'm a Forensics major. Give me chemistry, biology, physics, criminal justice. Not stuff that are completely unrelated to what I'll eventually do.

Do not get me started on this. Almost half of the courses I will be taking are GE courses. That's simply too much when you're just starting out, not sure what you want to go into. For instance, I would like to check out computer programing because I think that's a marketable career, but I have to take all these humanities courses and two DIFFERENT science courses (biology is a requirement too... and I hate biology). I mean, I'm sure it's nice to know these things, but most of these things I learned in high school, why do I need to know them again in college? I think that's the problem with education in general; years and years spent on math, history, reading, and science, but such little time to get to decide on your own major. At least that has been my experience.

[Rageaholic]

But grading before teaching is just wrong.

Exactly! It makes no sense!

[HYHYBT]

It sure seems all wrong to me; it ought to be read -> class -> homework. Reading is preparation for the class, where you get extra information and clear up anything you didn't quite understand, THEN homework on what you've learned. Possible exception if whether the homework is correct or not doesn't affect your grade, because in that case it could be useful in helping to see what to ask about. But grading before teaching is just wrong.

[BroomJockey]

I understand having the students read ahead, I don't understand having the homework due before the teacher goes over it.

you know a better way to ensure students actually read the text before class?

[TehShush]

That's a pretty common practice. "Read this chapter in preparation for class discussion on it." It's so you don't sit there and have no idea what the teacher is saying.

I understand having the students read ahead, I don't understand having the homework due before the teacher goes over it. A student can easily answer questions by looking through the textbook; however, they won't understand the material as they should, as they would if a teacher explained the finer details along the way.

[Greenday]

No... WHat I'm saying is if attendance is going to be manditory, then why make assignments due on the date you're going over the chapter. Otherwise, I see no reason to come to class if all we're doing is going over what we were already supposed to read.

That's a pretty common practice. "Read this chapter in preparation for class discussion on it." It's so you don't sit there and have no idea what the teacher is saying.

[Rageaholic]

HUH?

You hate mandatory attendance because it makes you do homework? Which helps you actually learn the material in the first place?

I don't even understand this. Honestly, if you don't want to go to class, don't go to school.

No... WHat I'm saying is if attendance is going to be manditory, then why make assignments due on the date you're going over the chapter. Otherwise, I see no reason to come to class if all we're doing is going over what we were already supposed to read.

[AdminAssistant]

The reading gets me too. At first, I didn't mind the textbooks much, but when taking other courses, any way to learn the material without having to ggo through to textbook is a blessing. Unfortunately, one of my classes makes this impossible. The assignments for each chapters are due the day we review that chapter in class. All the more reason why I hate manditory attendance.

HUH?

You hate mandatory attendance because it makes you do homework? Which helps you actually learn the material in the first place?

I don't even understand this. Honestly, if you don't want to go to class, don't go to school.

[Rageaholic]

1. There are some areas that do that more than others, I believe. I've never gotten a negative response about the fact that I go to a community college, though it might just be because of the recession and people in my city were hit pretty bad, so they know money can't be wasted on classes I can take for cheap.

Yup, it's upper class people that give me that crap. I just hate that snobbery like "we can afford stuff and you can't! nananana!". Like there's something bad about wanting to save money.

2. I was never the best student, mostly as I couldn't take multiple classes as well as other students. I was lucky if I got a B in a regular class, an A if it was one of those "You came to class? Wow, you're an awesome student!" kinda teachers giving the grade. So, when getting to college and only having two classes helped me focus, I got a final grade of 100 for each. With the exception of one class, I have had perfect or ner perfect grades each time... and it's made me one of those people who gets a bit bent out of shape when they get a B.

Same here. I cannot handle more than 12 credit hours and even that is pushing it. ESPECIALLY when the material is hard (coughaccountingcough). I've also had people brag about taking 15+ credit hours, trying to compare themselves to me. To which I say... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hR5YNqE3K8

3. & 4. I purposefully find laidback teachers, ones who teach and don't get all prissy over stuff like attendance and tardiness. If people don't make a big deal over a tardy, it doesn't really interrupt much. Then again, I don't attend 100+ student lectures that require you to listen closely, so I am a bit biased. The classes at my CC are about the size of the ones at highschool, the largest I saw was for about 40 students. In fact, my Thursday class is so small it is pretty much laughable! 11 students, including myself. It's an intro to internet course, which is a necessary elective that no one really 'learns' from... so the teacher herself told everyone that no one needs to come if they don't feel like it; she is required to be there, and whoever wants to hang out and go over the homework (definitions) is free to come and do so. [Mind you, most teachers aren't so laidback, it's mostly because the hardest thing we have gone over so far is what "CC" and "BCC" mean on an email because it's rarely used and thus rarely known.]
In a 'large' class of 30-ish students, where the teacher is up close to the students and has visual tools (board, projector, video, etc), a door opening takes little notice. The teacher looks up long enough to see who it is, yet continues talking as if nothing happened (*le gasp*) because they are smart enough to not interrupt their own speech about people interrupting the class. Again, the class can hear the teacher over small rustles, so a late student is barely noted when they get to their seat and pull out their classwork.

Yup. Ironically, it's usually the good teachers who get pissed at this sort of thing, you know, the ones who make it interesting. I just don't understand why teachers feel that such a minor distraction as being late is worth getting pissed off about. Sometimes you can't help being late.

5. Mmm, this is why I love Microsoft Office 7, the Word software does all that stuff for ya! In my old comp. class, we learned how to use all the new M. Office programs that were recently installed on the school computers. Click a button that gives you boxes to type information, it inputs it for you into the format you need as well as various other shortcuts. ^^; I sound like an ad for it, but oh well. I don't get so picky about citing stuff, my main issue is having a required number of sources. *eyeroll* Really? I can't just say something because I know it? I have to find that exact information somewhere in order to have a book/website/interview/etc source? (And I don't mean statistics kind of information, more along the lines of "the three axis powers were..." common knowledge stuff).

Luckly, one of my other english profs, showed us knightcite, whichs makes it all a hell of a lot easier. ANd you can focus on the actually material instead of the technical crap.

6. Yay for laidback teachers who teach instead of requiring a bunch of reading each night! Also, yay for websites like Chegg and Better World Books! I love getting overpriced books for $20, especially if it benefits others (such as the person who originally paid the full price, or how BWB focuses on world literacy).

I would suggest checking out ratemyprofessors.com if you haven't already, it's practically invaluable to a student who wants to find a decent teacher.

[/QUOTE]


The reading gets me too. At first, I didn't mind the textbooks much, but when taking other courses, any way to learn the material without having to ggo through to textbook is a blessing. Unfortunately, one of my classes makes this impossible. The assignments for each chapters are due the day we review that chapter in class. All the more reason why I hate manditory attendance.

[linguist]

I don't want to go off topic here, but just a random thought: What would happen to a student if they took a foreign language class, and then later the teacher discovers that the student is already fluent in that language? I.e. "Man, I need just 3 extra credits and I can't handle anything difficult...German? I'm German! I'm from Germany! I can do this class easy!"

i've been in classes where exactly this happened. honestly, often those students end up doing worse than the non-fluent speakers, because they think they can slack off since they already speak the language. also, many of them may speak fluently, but are unfamiliar with the written forms of the language or the formal grammar rules, on which they are graded as much as speaking ability.

[Arcade Man D]

I don't want to go off topic here, but just a random thought: What would happen to a student if they took a foreign language class, and then later the teacher discovers that the student is already fluent in that language? I.e. "Man, I need just 3 extra credits and I can't handle anything difficult...German? I'm German! I'm from Germany! I can do this class easy!"

I know my school won't let you get credits for trying to pull that.

[Rageaholic]

It's also invaluable to students who get mad at a professor who doesn't *gasp* bend over backward to give them the grade they want. I haven't looked for myself, but there are a few in the past that would give me bad ratings because I wouldn't let them re-write a paper, I caught them at plagiarism, or because I took off the set amount of points for missing most of the discussion sections.

There is also currently a lot of debate about the effectiveness of student evaluations. Hopefully, those will go by the wayside, since they rarely give any useful information and are a way for vengeful students to get 'back' at the professor.

I think student evaluations are a good thing. I find RMP very helpful in determining who to take, hell I've made my own evaluations.

Personally, I find the comments to say the most about the teacher. If I see "Assigns too much homework", "doesn't teach", or "is a jerk", enough, I will take that into account, but if it's just "ZOMG I H8 U1111", then I won't. I try to look for things like "really explains the material well" or if it's just a GE requirement "real easy". So far, it's done me wonders.

[DrFaroohk]

As far as attendence goes, there are often *very* good reasons to require it.

a) Any language class. The only way to actually learn a language is to use it. So you use it in the class.

b) Communications classes. Public Speaking, you need to be there to give your speeches, and evaluate your classmates' speeches.

c) Labs. Of any sort. You kinda have to be there to do them.

d) Quiz-heavy subjects, like math. If you don't show for the quizzes, you'll end up failing.

I'm all for that stuff, and I think its been mentioned a few times, but really, the grades should decide here whether you pass or fail, not what a professor feels like. If they got an A in the foreign language class and manage to complete all their labs with A++++++ efforts, guess what, they DID learn the material, whether they learned it from you the professor or from the textbook or from their tutor Barry.

I don't want to go off topic here, but just a random thought: What would happen to a student if they took a foreign language class, and then later the teacher discovers that the student is already fluent in that language? I.e. "Man, I need just 3 extra credits and I can't handle anything difficult...German? I'm German! I'm from Germany! I can do this class easy!"

[Rageaholic]

A better analogy would be that you paid for the mechanic, didn't show up to your scheduald time and so he refuses to fix your car, say what you want about being late and not attending but it's disrespectful to the teacher, it's basically saying that what they have to say and teach is beneath you to learn and that you're better and know more than someone who's spent years studying the subject you're reading out of a book.

But some teachers teach out of the textbook. So if I can read the textbook on my own time, why should I go to class just to have the teacher read it to me?

And to tell the truth, I'm not usually one to miss class unless I'm sick, sleep deprived, or too busy with other stuff (with the exception of one teacher who expected us to learn it all on our own, but I won't go there). In the end, it depends on the quality of the professor.