Tom Cruise's religion

[ArenaBoy]

DISCLAIMER: I'm not typing in the name out of fear of retaliation from them and i don't want Raps to get in trouble.

For those who know what his religion is, it's quite odd. From what I know and learned they happen to be quite out there. What's your opinion on TC's religion? Mine is that they're dangerous and quite vindicative should someone call them out.

[April]

I honestly don't know if I know enough about them to form a fully honest concrete debate about them.

That being said....I find the whole thing rather odd. Isn't the whole religion based on a Sci Fi book? A FICTION sci fi book?

I do find it rather cultish

[rahmota]

April:I know what you mean about the creation of the cruise cult. There is a story among sci-fi fans that the whole thing came about on a bet between RAH and LRH if an artificial religion could be created and take off. Apparently LRH won.

As for anything else about them. They are a very dangerous, strange and wierd cult.

[AFPheonix]

What little I know of it sounds like The Quest For More Money, moreso than other organized religions. It smells awfully funny to me.

[Rapscallion]

Um, we're talking about Scientology, a religion brought to everyone's attention by a noted Science Fiction author.

Can anyone see what his followers missed?

Rapscallion

[Dreamstalker]

Everything You (N)ever wanted to Know (http://www.xenu.net/)

Every so often, I think it's A&E who runs an expose program...very interesting.

[MadMike]

Um, we're talking about Scientology, a religion brought to everyone's attention by a noted Science Fiction author.


I remember them spoofing it on South Park (Tom Cruise will not come out of the closet!), which led Isaac Hayes to quit, which in turn led to a very mechanical-sounding Chef, right before they killed him off.

[Myra]

Yeah a sci-fi author by the name of L. Ron Hubbard had a theory. That one could become richer than the rich by founding his own religion. So he did. And by golly, he made a boatload of money before he died. Somehow, this "religion" is still going strong, with none of it's "followers" getting the joke. They thought this dude was serious, apparently.

But yeah. Tom Cruise is insane, and his "religion" is a cult. The requirement of money and other details fits the requirements to be considered a cult. Only thing they're missing is the kool-aid.

[ArenaBoy]

I remember them spoofing it on South Park (Tom Cruise will not come out of the closet!), which led Isaac Hayes to quit.

The reason being is that he himself is a follower of that cult. He left because he felt offended but there are some that are claiming that it was CoS spokespeople who said it and not him. There was an interview where he was aked how he felt about it to which he replied. Matt and Trey, they lampoon everything. If you take that shit seriously, I'll sell you the Brooklyn Bridge for $2 Quite a few Hollywood celebrities are CoSers themselves. Elvis' daughter being one of them along with Chick Corea (Jazz artist), John Travolta, Beck (Musician), and Katie herself.

Only thing they're missing is the kool-aid.

They have ways that kill their members in a more disturbing and psychotic way. They make sure that once you are in, you can't get out. They have a practice where if you start to dissent, they lock you up in a room and cut you off from the outside world for a while. People have died from this.

LRH also said "I think that the best way to make money is to start your own religion."

Their beliefs are if anything a little shoddy. Anti-psych is one of them. The irony of this is that LRH was found dead and had psych drugs in his system.

[EmiOfBrie]

CULT OF SCIENTOLOGY
(to the tune of "Cult of Personality" by Living Colour)
Lyrics ©2007 Emi M. Briet


Look in this book, what do you see
The Cult of Scientology
I hear your questions, I know your dreams
We've got everything that you could need
The Cult of Scientology
Like John Travolta, and his wife Kelly
We're the Cult of Scientology, The Cult of Scientology, The Cult of Scientology

We defy Nobel Prize
Cause when Xenu speaks, our brain cells die
Spend some cash and follow me
We can set the Thetans free

We'll sell you life, as you can see
We're the actors from film and TV
We're the Cult of Scientology
And we'll sue you, if you mock me
With Thetans one body makes three!
In the Cult of Scientology
Like Tommy Cruise, and Lisa Marie
We're the Cult of Scientology, The Cult of Scientology, The Cult of Scientology

Keep our eyes, on the prize
Only with your help, can Xenu die
Spend some cash and follow me
We can set the Thetans free

We need your fortune
You'll gain your fame
We'll give you power in L Ron's name!
Speak for the Thetans you need to free
We're. The. Cult. of. Sci. En. Tol. Ogy!
We're the cult of
We're the cult of
We're the cult of
We're the cult of
We're the cult of
We're the cult of
We're the cult of Scientology

[Boozy]

South Park is one of the smartest and most offensive shows on TV. But the thing is, they're EQUAL OPPORTUNITY offenders. They don't care what race or creed you are, they'll call your group idiots regardless. :)
Politically, it IS pretty liberal...but even then, they did a great episode on hybrid cars and the "smug" attitude of those who drive them.

Back on topic:
The beliefs of Scientologists are incredibly outlandish, but then, so are the beliefs of Christians and Muslims and Jews. The problem is really how they treat their members - once you're in, you're never getting out, and you're going to have to give them a hell of a lot of your money. That's cult practice.

[SongsOfDragons]

Scientology? What a load of crap. There's a bunch of them down at Winchester Market, trying to get people to take 'free stress tests'. This is a university city, with lots of POOR STUDENTS...

...who'd rather use the money to LIVE...

...and who'd rather pull pranks on the sorry twits.

We were talking of linking arms and skipping down Market Street, right in front of them, singing 'We Love You Xeeeenu, and if it's quite all right We Love You Xeeeeenu!!' at the tops of our voices.
Now these money-grabbing anti-medical scum think you have to be a certain level to even hear Xenu's name or else you catch pneumonia, so we reckon we'll get quite a good response.

I have respect for all religions...except this one.

[Dreamstalker]

Ugh...yeah, there's a scientology church downtown. I don't really go down that part of Mass Ave anymore so I don't get harassed as much as I used to, but every so often I'll see them trying to reel people in for a free "scientology is good" film/stress test. Once I even saw little kids handing out fliers for them (in near-blizzard 15 degree weather I might add) :eek:

I think one of the sites linked to in the link I posted has a full copy of the stress/personality test and the "right" answers.

[ArenaBoy]

WARNING: THERE ARE GRAPHIC PICTURES IN THIS LINK. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.

http://www.whyaretheydead.net/

I forgot to mention that I know a guy who almost joined Scientology and he said he backed out as he didn't like the negative energy he got from them. More reasons as to why I hate this group.

[CancelMyService]

The ironic thing is by all accounts this was LRH's attempt to set up his own religion as stated, but he seemed to have undiagnosed mental problems (which is where Scientology's hate of psychatrists comes from) that got worse as he grew older, and by the end of his life he was pretty much completely batshit insane to the point where he'd make Tom Cruise look pretty vanilla.

The "Church" thrives on completely cutting off members from all non Scientology influences, told that everyone else is out to destroy them. If your raised in a CoS family and decide to leave, you're most likely to never see your family again since they will fear reprisals if they keep in contact with you.

What bothers me is they prey on people with addiction (with their Narcon program) and learning disabilites (how Tommy Boy became a member, they cured his dyslexia don'tcha know?) , then have them reeled in to their "auditing" BS by saying it's a requirement of treatment.

[NightAngel]

I live in Scientologist Central.

In general, most people around here quietly hate them and/or are afraid of them. I know where the celebs like Tom Cruise and John Travolta shop, etc. I make no point of going to those places and maybe make a point to stay away.

Driving through downtown is disconcerting to say the least. There are hundreds of them- all dressed alike with their weird, blank stares.

One day some people I know and I were driving through downtown. At a stoplight I was looking out the car window at the throngs of them. One of my passengers, terrified, says, "DON'T LOOK AT THEM! They may decide to kill us! Or worse! Try and convert us!" She was Dead. Serious.

Now, outside that centralized area it's actually a bit rare to see them. I've been here 5 or 6 years and not once has anyone ever approached me about Scientology. Other than when I have to go to the courthouse or something I never see them. It's also rare to hear people talking about them... really, they may as well be a thousand miles away.

[ArenaBoy]

Nightangel I take it that you live near Clearwater then? That is a haven for them as I'm sure you already know. A lot of creepy stuff has happened in that area BTW. I know of one COS in my county but it's on the other side of the county.

[NightAngel]

Yes, I live in the Clearwater area.

A year or so ago the Scientologists attacked the Clearwater Police Department. A lot of people hoped that they'd be driven out of town after that- but they weren't. They own a great deal of the downtown area so I think they're here to stay.

[Brede]

One of the things I really dislike is their insistence of using vitamins to cure severe ilnesses. Mainly cause it makes nutritionist look like wacko's. The right herbs and vitamins can IMPROVE symptoms of sever mental and physical illnesses, but only alongside conventional treatment.

*sigh* It is a cult. No question about that. It fills all the requirements.

[NightAngel]

I have to say this even though it's slightly OT.

I had a guy come in to my store asking me to recommend movies to him. I thought it would be no problem as that's what I do for a living.

After some discussion to get on track with what he was in the mood for I suggested several movies. He declined them ALL stating that he wouldn't watch anything with any Scientologists in them. Now, I understand disliking Scientology and maybe it was just the way this guy said it but it grated my nerves and sounded really idiotic.
Well, that and the fact that some of the movies didn't even have any Scientologists in them as far as I know which made it that much worse.

I'm just not going to punish myself by not watching good movies because I don't agree with an actor/ress personal view points.:rolleyes:
Plus, it takes a lot of people to make a movie- not just that one Scientologist.

Gah!

[AFPheonix]

I think in the case of that guy, I'd just lead him to the subtitled foreign films and let him go to town there :)

[Seshat]

The right herbs and vitamins can IMPROVE symptoms of sever mental and physical illnesses, but only alongside conventional treatment.

Except in the case of deficiency disorders. ;)

Why yes, I AM a smartass. Nice of you to notice. :D

[NightAngel]

I think in the case of that guy, I'd just lead him to the subtitled foreign films and let him go to town there :)

You assume that my customers can read. That's sweet of you. :D

[AFPheonix]

I always try to presume the best out of people....keeps me somewhat sane ;)

[CancelMyService]

I don't usually let actor's beliefs get in the way of enjoying a movie, but I can't watch Tom Cruise in a movie and not immediately think of him as a couch-jumping crazy cultist rather than whatever character he's supposed to be.

I mean, I can watch Chuck Norris movies and not have my liberal sensibilities offended by the fact he endorses Fundimentalist whackadoodles for President , but Tom Cruise just takes me right out of any movie I see him in.

[rahmota]

Well this is intersting:http://http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/12/07/germany.scientology.ap/index.html

The interior ministers of the nation's 16 states plan to give the nation's domestic intelligence agency the task of preparing the necessary information to ban the organization, which has been under observation for a decade on allegations that it "threatens the peaceful democratic order" of the country.

Apparently they feel that this ology is not a good thing and very not beneficial to society in general.

Whats funny in a side not is this The U.S. State Department regularly criticizes Germany in its annual Human Rights Report for the monitoring practice.
Does the US State Department have a good enough credability and history on human rights themselves to be able to criticize anyone else?

[Boozy]

Does the US State Department have a good enough credability and history on human rights themselves to be able to criticize anyone else?

No.

But they sure do like to criticize.

[AFPheonix]

It's kind of one of those "do as I say, not as I do" sorts of things, I suppose.

[tropicsgoddess]

I just don't see how something that uses e-meters,dianetcs and has a membership system that was created by a dead science-fiction writer classifying as a religion. Sounds more like a cult to me.

[Dreamstalker]

Oh, it is. Google "Operation Clambake". That's all you ever wanted to know.

[I8DaCookie]

Or for a real eye opener:

http://www.whyaretheydead.net/

[Dreamstalker]

WOW :eek: I had no idea there were so many deaths connected with the freakshow. And this isn't actually investigated why?...oh that's right, they probably have the local police/government in their pockets too.

My grandfather used to go to Clearwater for a few weeks every winter. I always thought there was something weird about that place...I did not know it was the Scientology central hive until a few years ago.

[IDrinkaRum]

http://www.clambake.org/archive/books/tsos/sos.html

I found the above link while just cruising online about Scientology. The author of the piece, did an article about the religion back in the late 1960's. For a long time after that, they tried to get her on federal charges, state charges and even tried to make her crazy. It's appalling! Sheesh.

[Slytovhand]

Damn.. why did I take so long to get to the Fratching ???

It would seem that I am the only person on here who has had direct contact with the Co$, and also its 'squirrel' organisation, the Freezone.

What has so far appeared on here about it is the standard propaganda that gets dredged up all the time...which is really annoying. Because it's the same sort of thing as saying "All christians are wacked out because of the Spanish Inquisition", or "all Muslims are psycho because of the extreme suicide bombers" etc...


I'll interject some facts along with some opinions and observations here...(and also report on some of the other stuff I've noted - both direct and indirect. And by that, I mean from a person who was my best mate for 19 years who was a staff member in there. And I also volunteered in one of the churches (aka 'orgs' - short for organisation) as well as information from others from the Freezone.

yes - LRH was a sci-fi writer. Apparently he did a bet - and won (as mentioned). I believe that the universe decided to have a bit of a laugh - and give him a stack of good and useful information - it seems to have a weird sense of humour!!

The Co$ (or church of scio) is, in my opinion an organisation that is basically corrupt and money hungry - but has a stack of people in it who have genuine interests in helping themselves and others. By corrupt, I mean that while they have a stack of rules, ethics, regulations and ways to behave etc etc, they will easily bypass that to get what they want - hence all of the above links. Yes - the Co$ will drive people to suicide. They will charge people disgusting amounts of money for their 'services' - politely called a 'donation' - it sucks!!

But it does have some very good tech! I have personally experienced some of those techniques - I have put them to good use, and am looking to do so again - to the point that I moved 2500K's to come to someone for such tech (too bad he was not one of the good ones). I'm looking again to do the same (or similar).

Although you have the 'look out they're nasty' links above, try going to Freezone.org and do some searching there. Also try googling Clearbird and "pilot's self-clearing book". They take the good stuff, and offer it up (well - not quite free, but at a value that is fair - one was offering to train people for free, as long as they gave back for free. Now how good would that be??)

Those (and others) were the people who have experienced the good, the bad and the ugly. They recognise that the Co$ is a real real bad placer to be. But they also know there there are some brilliant techniques that will improve your life!


Now - I'll just let it go for that at the moment - but if anyone wishes to continue this thread, I'm happy to oblige :D

Slyt

[I8DaCookie]

It would seem that I am the only person on here who has had direct contact with the Co$, and also its 'squirrel' organisation, the Freezone.

While I may not have ever been "in", I do believe that I have educated myself enough to know what goes on. It would be the same as saying I was never part of the of the Peoples Temple (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peoples_Temple)but I certainly was educated enough to know how bad they were.

The Co$ (or church of scio) is, in my opinion an organisation that is basically corrupt and money hungry - but has a stack of people in it who have genuine interests in helping themselves and others.

Yes, I believe most people who are in Co$ believe they're doing good work and helping themselves. Personally, I have no issue with these people. They've been hidden away from the critics and fed lies about the Co$ agenda. Critics are out there trying to educate about the corruption of the Co$. I for one thank these people who have gotten out and told their story. Most recently, Jenna Miscavage-Hill, neice of David Miscavage...head of the Co$.

Here is her Nightline interview. She was a child of Scientology, raised within the cult and experience horrible treatment. She finally had enough and got out, along with her husband. She's been harassed ever since. But she's not staying quiet and telling people what she went through: Part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnbQKQAbVlg), Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D63-BThSYRc)

You want someone more famous? Here's Jason Beghe's (http://www.youtube.com/user/JasonBeghe) youtube account. The videos he's posted is the interview done by Mark Bunker, a very prominent So$ critic (who can't post his own videos because youtube suspended his account because of "copyright infringment." This was just days after another critic Tory Magoo had her account reinstated with no explaination as to why it was suspended in the first place.)

Explain to me why is it that we can openly critisize any other religion on national television without any retribution (sans posting images of Muhammad), but if even the slightest thing is said against the Co$ they go after them to silence them? Why is it that took so long for carefully written and thought out 1-star reviews that were not violating any criteria in any way to finally be posted without delelition on Amazon.com? Why is it that the Co$ will send out fliers to critic's neighbors stating lies about alleged child abuse and other crimes without any proof? Because they feel it is their right, as any critic is Fair Game (http://www.fairgamed.org/fairgame.htm). Take note of what they may do to an "Enemy." There is a following letter that states that it was disconntinued. But read carefully on the last line. (Suppressive Person/SP = Enemy).

Fair game still continues. That is why the Anonomous protesters wear masks, to keep themselves and their families safe from Fair Game. No, I am not a member but I support them. And any Co$ accusations of them issuing death and bomb threats is not Anon. The last theme for their protest was Opperation Reconnect due to the Co$ policy of forcing people to disconnect from friends and family declared an SP. Meaning, they can no longer have any communication with them. Here is one person's story (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCf7DsjyFkM&feature=related), and another (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siNbQTWskZY&feature=related), and another (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHTtpLorEe4&feature=related).

Read the personal stories (http://ocmb.xenu.net/ocmb/index.php?f=3)of those who were in and what they went through. Read the stories of those who were raised in the cult (http://www.exscientologykids.com/storiesindex.html). The Co$ would have you believe that these people were simply dissatisfied with the tech and weren't fulfilled by their experiences. They would have you believe that these people are spreading lies. With so many people telling the same story about abuse, threats, forced labor and other cruelties...how can you ignore the danger of the cult.

You want to believe the tech works? Fine, I really could care less.

But you can't ignore the criminality of the Co$.

Opperation Clambake (http://www.xenu.net/)

[Slytovhand]

Hey Cookie.

I am aware of certainly some of what you have said, and I have cast my eyes over Operation Clambake a couple of times. And I'm not going to argue against what you've brought up (or anyone else) as far as the Co$.

But, my thoughts above are trying to distinguish between the 'religion' (or technology) per se, and the organisation itself. Christianity has had its fair share of stuff go on that 'shouldn't' happen, yet the religion as a whole doesn't get thrown out the door because of it.

You want to believe the tech works? Fine, I really could care less.
Precisely my point! Now...tell me about the Freezone....

Ultimately, humans are humans - no matter what beliefs they choose to follow. Some are good, unfortunately, others aren't.

[IDrinkaRum]

http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9935077-7.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20

Apparently, when you type the words "Tom Cruise" into Google, the first couple of links to pop up are for the soon-to-be-online official website for Scientology. Interesting. :D

[Slytovhand]

Oh dear.....<sigh>

I do wonder what it is with him. I mean, there's so many other famous people out there who have gone through those ranks, but they don't have the same...influence. Was there something in him before he turned to the Co$ to given any indication???

Or is he just trying to compete with Michael Jackson?

[AFPheonix]

Watching that interview of him that came out earlier this year made me pretty much realize he's gone off the bloody deep end. Holy crap. Countdown to when he starts wearing tissue boxes on his feet and not clipping his fingernails.

[aniwahya]

I am annoyed that Tom Cruise has taken a plunge off the deep end. He is the only well know person I know who is also a moon-scorpio and sun-gemini ><
Signs can be fun, but not when you try to explain things to people and your example is a nutcase. ><

[Slytovhand]

I am annoyed that Tom Cruise has taken a plunge off the deep end. He is the only well know person I know who is also a moon-scorpio and sun-gemini ><
Signs can be fun, but not when you try to explain things to people and your example is a nutcase. ><

Why does that annoy you?

And what else would you expect with that combination?

Besides... define 'nutcase'?

[aniwahya]

I was being facetious about being annoyed. Well, I am annoyed, but it is not something that I sit around and ponder. Short version, I am annoyed because now when i use Tom Cruise as an example people generally exclaim that he is crazy, and be cause I used him as an example when referring back to myself, I must be crazy. The illogic of it annoys me. Therefore Tom Cruise being my only example annoys me.

Bah! Just because we are the "dark side" of the gemini population doesn't mean we are inherently crazy. *twitch* <tongue firmly in cheek>

"
nutcasenoun
someone deranged and possibly dangerous " from dictionary.com


The general populace seems to have a working consensus that Tom Cruise has dropped his marbles and failed to find them all. Using someone as an example when popular belief* labels him a "nutcase" has certain, shall we say, difficulties associated with it. :(

*Getting into the demographics of where this line of thought comes from, and whether it has proven validity would entail a discussion involving things I refer to as "the lemming principle" and discussions of Oprah's popularity, and the evils enacted by fascist regimes.

In other words I am most annoyed. :p

[Slytovhand]

Gemini. Nutcase.

I can see them being used in the same sentence :p

I'm curious as to why you're concentrating on the moon sign anyway.. and the sun for that matter. Moon is for how the emotions are felt and expressed (being Scorpio, they are deep, hidden, passionate...but when they come out, they come out... powerfully). And the Sun is only about where one's 'power' in life will be expressed. Gemini would be ... lots of different things, mostly mental/academic issues, and often contradictory...

Far better to look at the Ascendant, which rules the personality in general.


Getting back to Tom-boy... I'm still curious as to why the general populace seems to have a working consensus that he's a nutcase.... Is jumping up and down on a lounge any more crazy than having "Aniwahya - I love you" done in skywriting across the city? How about being seranaded in public?... Marry Me on the big electronic scoreboards at a major sporting event???

I'd say... society has major issues that fall within the 'nutcase' label because in general we don't know how to freely express our inner emotions effectively...


Slyt

[friendofjimmyk]

Silly me. I came here and just immediately posted my ideas on Scientology before checking to see if there was another post about it! Sorry that I started an entire new thread dedicated to this wacky cult.