Anime snobs

[Lace Neil Singer]

This is something that really gets on my nerves. There are a lot of anime fans who sneer at people who like popular animes, and act as tho they're better cuz they like the obscure ones that hardly anyone has heard of.

I like Naruto. There, I said it. :rolleyes: I find it fun to watch, I like the characters, who are well rounded with faults and flaws like real people, and it's funny in parts. I generally prefer to watch the sub, then the dub, cuz the subbed is unedited and the dub shows me things I missed while reading subs. However, a lot of anime snobs sneer at fans of the show and refuse to class it as a "proper" anime.

I like other animes too; including some that were around when a lot of these snobs, who tend to be teens, were sucking their thumbs and having their nappies changed. However, a lot of snobs just assume that anyone who likes Naruto is a total anime philistine and therefore not worth talking to.

[tabbyblack13]

I don't consider myself a snob but I do have my likes and dislikes. I love anime but personally can't stand Naruto. I grew up with Dragonball Z and can no longer stand the chi fighting style. I have seen these people and been around them. They are fools if they think that because of the shows they watch makes them a special little snowflake. They want to believe that they are special when they are like everyone else. As for the obscure anime, these usually are this way for a reason. A small audience due to the genre is one of many reasons. If an anime that these snobs like becomes popular they will either say "I told you so" or start insulting the show.

I watch a verity of anime from Hellsing, Ghost in the Shell, Blue Seed, and ect. When a new anime comes on I try to give it a chance. I can only watch what I like and if I don't like it from the beginning I won't bother with it.

[Lace Neil Singer]

Ghost In The Shell rules; I sadly had my video borrowed and not returned a while ago, and haven't been able to replace it. -.-

I understand someone disliking an anime for the reasons you gave; it's just the people who stand there sneering at the anime just cuz it's popular; and you're dead on the money as far as the obscure ones go. I've watched one or two, just to see what all the fuss is about and they're nothing special.

I've watched bits and pieces from Hellsing and I like it; Elfen Lied I love; Inuyasha gets on my nerves cuz it's packed with filler. -.- I know that Naruto has some filler, but at least the filler episodes are mostly watchable.

Slightly going off on a tangent, I also dislike people who think they're special just cuz they read the manga. Not everyone has access to manga; where I live, there's not anywhere to buy it save at this one shop, and that shop only does certain mangas. In any case, I don't have the time or money to devote to buying manga; I will read it if I'm linked to online mangas but I prefer to watch anime cuz to me, it just flows better.

[anakhouri]

I have no problem with people watching whatever they like. Teenagers especially may not have access to a wide variety of anime and manga and are stuck with what is available on the Cartoon Network and online; stuff like Naruto and Bleach. I don't particularly like either but if it's something you enjoy, go for it.

I stick with more mature stuff myself- obviously I'm a huge fan of the Ghost in the Shell universe. ^_^

I disagree about obscure anime though. There are some truly great anime series that just fly under the radar . Kino's Journey...Mushishi...Monster...all divine recent series that few people watch. There are no hot chicks or mecha or sword fights, so most anime fans aren't interested in them. :rolleyes: Wait, I guess that sounded snobbish. I mean the main demographic of anime fans in America are teens (there are adult fans too- I'm 30- but the majority of fans I have seen are teenagers) and they aren't interested in quiet series like Mushishi.

[Lace Neil Singer]

I'm not bothered about whether it's obscure or not; if it's good, has an interesting storyline and characters you can care a damn about, then it passes. Same goes for books, movies etc. A lot of animes are based on books or movies or video games; I've heard that there's an Earthsea anime around, based on the books, which I'd like to see. Howl's Moving Castle was based on a book too, I think, tho I haven't read the book, only seen the anime.

Interestingly, I've seen the movie of Death Note but haven't gotten round to viewing the anime. I disagree with your statement that you can't find anything save Bleach and Naruto online; it's all there, if you know where to look. One of my fave animes is Streetfighter; I found that online, in parts. You can also buy videos of anime in places very cheaply.

I guess my point is, that there is no point in attacking someone for their likes and dislikes. I've just found far more snobbish behaviour among the anime community than in any other genre, which is just irritating to me. Hell, I even had a thirteen year old Avatar fan tell me that Naruto wasn't a real anime; the irony! XD

[Sylvia727]

The book of Howl's Moving Castle is nothing like the anime. In the book, there is no war, there is no war (it's important enough to say twice), there is no steampunk, Howl's curse is not transforming into a giant bird monster, all of the characters are fleshed out with actual personalties, Sophie's family members (both sisters) play pivotal roles in the plot, Michael is about 16 instead of about 10, the bad guy of the movie is the good guy of the book and vice versa...I could rant for a very long time. Basically, the anime chopped the character list in half and ignored the breaking-the-curses plot in favor of a new war plot.

I read the book first, and was ecstatic to hear there would be a movie, but I really think of them as two different stories that happen to have some characters with the same names. Besides giving me visuals for the book, the only two things I think the anime did better than the book was expressing Calcifer's personality (I'm really a powerful fire demon! Rar!) and the way Sophie's curse changes with how old she's feeling at the moment, which really ties into the book's plot well. I reread the book hoping to use "changing age" as an alternative interpretation, but the text doesn't directly support it very well. If anyone intends to read the book second, I warn you the book moves more slowly and doesn't have any bombs at all. I still like it better though.

[Lace Neil Singer]

I still want to read it. XD The Earthsea anime doesn't follow the books very closely, or so I've heard; the premis is much the same, but it's basically a new story with elements from the books.

I love Calcifer; he's easily my favourite character.

[anakhouri]

As a huge LeGuin fan, I thought the Earthsea movie was wretched. It combines The Farthest Shore and Tehanu, but not well, and I thought it made little sense as a standalone movie either.

Just my opinion though. It's the first Ghibli movie I ever hated. :(

I haven't read Howl's Moving Castle but I did like the film. :o

[Sylvia727]

The Earthsea anime cannot be worse than the Earthsea miniseries. If it is, my soul will be crushed. I got about sixty seconds into the miniseries- I turned it off after 1) the characters were white 2) Sparrowhawk was addressed as "Ged" and 3) their first conversation was a clumsy info-dump on the nature of magic. Three strikes and my brain is out. LeGuin critisized the miniseries heavily, especially how they changed all of the characters from blacks to whites. I haven't seen the anime but I hope it's at least a tiny bit better.

[anakhouri]

In the anime, all the characters are also white. :( Ged has a slightly darker skin tone than everyone else though.

It's not worse than the Sci Fi Channel (sorry...SYFY Channel) travesty, but it's not much better either.

I taped the miniseries and fast forwarded through most of it, only giving up completely when I saw that the Undertomb was INCREDIBLY WELL-LIT. :mad:

[Slytovhand]

Firstly - THANKS!!!! for informing me Earthsea had been brought out of the books! I loved that series! (all 5 of them... although the filler #4 was a little meh). Oh, and in searching for this, I found that it was also a mini-series brought out a few years ago (that'd be the 'movie' I presume...). So far, I like it!! (other than the bad CGI on the city/castle flyover shots)

Secondly, I'm going to be a bit snobbish (apparently). 'Popular' often means 'trite' these days. Just because something is popular doesn't mean it's actually any good. And the obscure is often better because it is more...'meaningful' (or crap :p)

[Lace Neil Singer]

Warning; the following will show me to be a complete geek. XD

1) the characters were white

Argh. Just, argh. Only the Kargs are described as being white; they are white with blonde hair. The other people, including Sparrowhawk, have dark skins; Vetch is described as black, if I'm remembering correctly. There are no white major characters, cept for Tenar. Jeez. :rolleyes:

2) Sparrowhawk was addressed as "Ged"

*screams for about half an hour* Didn't these people you know, READ the fucking books?! The premis is that people don't give out their true name; they have a "use name" which they use. Only Tenar and Lebannen go by their real names, at least in the last book anyway; and both of them have use names too. Sparrowhawk never is addressed by Ged, save by those who know his real name; everyone else calls him Sparrowhawk.


I taped the miniseries and fast forwarded through most of it, only giving up completely when I saw that the Undertomb was INCREDIBLY WELL-LIT.

For fuck's sake. -.- It's dark. Tenar finds her way around by touch and memory, for the love of fucking CHEESE. No-one ever uses a light in the Undertomb, which was why Tenar was so shocked to see one there when Sparrowhawk went there to steal the half of the ring.


OK, went a bit off topic there; anyways, I posted that rant after being bitched at by teens for daring to have a Naruto-themed Gaia signature; it's of Gaara actually, due to my having a similar temperament cept for the random killings of course. (or is it? :p) One was an Avatar fan; Avatar is far more obviously not a "real" anime cuz it was made in America, not in Japan; however, I would not dream of bitching at people who like it. Each to their own; their enjoyment of it doesn't affect me in any way.

I tend to point and laugh at a lot of Naruto fans too; especially all the crazed Sasuke fangirls. XD They make me laugh; especially if you put the words "Sasuke" and "gay" together. Honestly, the guy turned down two hot babes to run off after a Michael Jackson lookalike. What does that say to you? :p

[Slytovhand]

Vetch is described as black When I first saw him, I thought he looked like Jack Black.. does that count?? :p

Now.. the Sparrowhawk bit. Remember, I read these about a decade or so ago, so memory is a bit fuzzy on this bit. I thought Sparrowhawk was his 'use' name, and Ged was his True Name. But that could easily be mixing them up. I thought I also recall him using his True name extensively in the last couple of books, because he had defeated the Gebbeth, and thus his 'true name' was no longer accurate or true for him... or that no-one could claim power over him because of his dealing with the shadow side of himself...??? Lace?

Oh, and most don't really know their truename. It takes a wizard to find it out for you (IIRC).

So far, although I don't remember everything clearly, I am liking what I've seen. And I can deal with minor alterations that don't do a lot of change for the plot. (although... Roke got raided and the archmage killed???? I don't recall that bit!)

[Sylvia727]

You're right, Slyt, Sparrowhawk is his usename and Ged is his truename. The miniseries got that horribly, horribly wrong, along with everything else in the plot. Though to me, the most horrible and irredeemable mistake was making all of the characters white (exept for Tenar, who is white in the books and Asian in the miniseries). LeGuin deliberately wrote most of the protagonists to be nonwhite since nonwhites were so scarce in the genre (getting a little better now). It was a conscious choice both in terms of the internal geography and the real world politics. Apparently, Earthsea had a huge impact on nonwhite fantasy fans of the time, since it was one of few or the only fantasy novel to cast someone of their race as a protagonist. For the miniseries to screw that up so dramatically...

From LeGuin. (http://locusmag.com/2005/Issues/01LeGuin.html)

[Lace Neil Singer]

In the book, the archmage Nemmerele (spelling is off, but I can't be bothered to look it up right now) died after saving Sparrowhawk from the shadow, when he summoned it by mistake; he was actually summoning Elfarren, but the shadow came too. O.o The archmage Gensher died of old age, and Sparrowhawk was the next archmage. No mention whatsoever of Roke being raided.

Slyt, the shadow wasn't a Gebbeth all the time; only when it was persuing Sparrowhawk in the body of Skiorh when he ended up at the court of the Terranon. It was a shadow beast thing most of the time, with claws. O.o It clawed Sparrowhawk accross his face and he kept the scars for ever after.

[Slytovhand]

Ah, good, my memory hasn't faded too much!

Yeah, I was looking for scars....?????

And, of course, now that you mention it all, it all comes rushing back... like a brick.

Wasn't there something about the mages being disbanded or something, and Ged getting them back together again??

I read the Locus link - thanks Sylvia!

Again, now that I've finally finished said movie, I like it! It brought back memories... (obviously false ones :p)

I think they gave the idea of how magic works a quick bit, but glossed over... but you expect that in movies based on books....

Though.. I'm dreading what they'll do with Elric...<shudder>

[Lace Neil Singer]

Wasn't there something about the mages being disbanded or something, and Ged getting them back together again??

That happened in Tehanu; there wasn't an archmage to replace Sparrowhawk and the mages on Gont couldn't find one. He lost all his wizardry in the dry land in order to fix what was wrong.

[Wingates_Hellsing]

I never liked Naruto, Gundam or any of the Anime that most people like if only because I either found the main characters supremely annoying, or the general style annoying.

I like Hellsing and Blue Gender because they cut out all the over hyped, sugar rushed, ravetastic flying backgrounds and weird 'super attacks' with a more western approach of making a relatively small number of changes to the world and examining how that effects other things.

Sure, Seras has a veritable cannon as a rifle, but does she start spouting catchprhases and use it to launch heat-seeking missiles? no, she shoots you with it.

Alucard never seems to stop yammering about blood, gore, the pathetic nature of his enemy etc. but it never strays far from what's going on and his general delight in taunting his enemies.

But none of that is what drives me away from anime fans. It's the seemingly endless number of 'super fans' that get on my nerves. The ones who are simply obsessed with every single detail of their chosen show, who never shut up about their vast knowledge and never stop insisting that you 'just watch it once!'

Granted, I've met one or two Hellsing fans who took it a little far (one was trying to find out exactly what type of cannon Seras' is based on and the other was busy deciphering what was written on Alucard's gloves) But I'm ready to say that about one in three Naruto fans, half of all DBZ fans, and four out of five Gundam fans that I have met all fell into this category.

So please understand Anime fans of the world, it's not you, it's not your show, it's that past experience has taught me that I'm more or less doomed to loathe many of the people in the room.

Understandably, this makes me somewhat less than happy to be there.

End of song.

[Slytovhand]

Well Wingates... I personally think that's with everything - die hard fans who reckon their particular cup of tea is so awesome, it's all they rave about... and you have to as well!

I'm a little like that with my brand of metal.. they do awesome stuff, and is atypical of what most ppl think metal is about... but - I can't even name all the members of the band :p

Hellsing?? Ok, if I can, I might try to find it and see what it's like (I'm a noob when it comes to anime! Only seen a season or so of Ghost, a bit of Evangelion and of course.... Akira).

[DesignFox]

Slyt, Hellsing is excellent! I'd highly recommend it. Friends of mine that don't typically watch anime, have enjoyed Hellsing. It is fantastic.

[AFPheonix]

I will echo the Hellsing love. That guy cracks me up.

My husband got me Mushishi for my birthday, and that is a gorgeous one. I've really enjoyed the storytelling in it.

Appleseed is a fun shoot-em-up movie too.

Last Exile is visually beautiful and a great story, same with Samurai 7.

[fireheart17]

My anime tastes range from the common to the obscure.

Yes, I love Sailor Moon. I also love One Piece.

I also love Chobits, FMA, Negima and Haruhi Suzumiya, as well as Full Metal Panic and it's spinoff. I love the Studio Ghibli films...

So my anime/manga tastes tend to vary. I don't have a particular favourite genre, although I've found that while the shojo stuff is cute, some of it is a bit too cute for me.

[the_std]

fireheart, I have to ask. Is acceptance of anime in your general culture more prevalent than it is here in North America, because of your proximity to Japan? Or is it still viewed by mainstream society as kids stuff, not worth wasting your time on?

[Slytovhand]

Anime is still in the realms of 'geek' in Australia.

While Australia is pretty multi-cultural, a large part of society is still very English/American in it's attitudes... and European (esp East European). Experimenting in other cultures is huge on our list of interests, that seems to be as far as it goes (ie, you won't see much of an influx of musical tastes influencing our musicians... and those that do are considered 'alternative' - pop/rock still leads the way).

Interestingly enough, while we are fairly multi-cultural from around the world, there doesn't seem to be a hell of a lot of Japanese communities (unless that just happens to be what I've noticed!). But there can be an obvious reason for that - most people emmigrate to get a better life for themselves, to get away from something. Japan is doing pretty damn well in that regards.

Anyone care to take issue with what I've said??? After all, no stats, just my thoughts on it.... :D

[Lace Neil Singer]

Over where I am, it's firmly in the "geek" category, along with sci-fi and comics. Altho certain comic characters are starting to become mainstream, cuz of movies, anime hasn't yet moved into the mainstream as of yet.

Wingates, I have just two words for you; Kiss fans. Honest, there are fans who do exactly all you discribe and more, who are obsessed with the band to the extent that if Gene Simmons wiped his arse and sold the toilet roll on ebay, they'd be bidding thru the roof. O_o They also tend to turn purple with rage and rant like lunatics if anyone dares to criticize the band or its members in any way.

I'm a fan. However, I'm not obsessed. I hate certain members. I know all the band member's names, and real names, but I'm not about to fork out £100 for a ticket to see a glorified tribute act, dammit. I am certainly not buying a fucking Kiss coffin. Honestly, fanatics come in all shapes and form and are just as irritating to regular fans of the show/band/film as they are to non-fans.

[AdminAssistant]

Honestly, fanatics come in all shapes and form and are just as irritating to regular fans of the show/band/film as they are to non-fans.

THIS.

I'm a huge Dresden Dolls/Amanda Palmer fan. I have a lot of respect for the art she produces. But her super-obsessive fangirls/fanboys drove me absolutely nuts at the Dolls concert I went to.

[fireheart17]

Slyt's pretty much summed it up over here. Yes, I am a bit of a geek and I don't mind it. A lot of my friends at work and uni identify with certain anime, but don't consider themselves geeks. A few bookstores have introduced bits and pieces of manga, along with anime DVDs in some DVD stores, one of the game stores I know is BIG on anime/manga stuff and a bookstore in the city has an entire section just full of manga and comic books.

[Slytovhand]

Ooops - I missed something in my previous post...

Experimenting in other culture's FOOD is huge on our list of interests,..