GamerGate WTF?

[Gravekeeper]

He never wrote about Quinn after they started dating?

That was before, check your timeline. -.-

Its also the only article he ever wrote for Kotaku that involved Quinn and its not exactly ABOUT Quinn now is it?

Plus, this is the same Gawker Media that seems to think it's okay to out a gay man, publish a washed-up pro wrestler's sex tape and refuse to take it down, slut-shamed a political candidate under the pretense that 'it was in the best interest of our readers', and wrote up a piece for their Deadspin site in response to the #CancelColbert movement that can be summarized as 'make Suey Park look hysterical, oh, and let's give it an inflammatory headline because humor lol'.

And have you seen the fallout from said incident? I believe they lost what, two editors over the first one and nearly imploded under backlash from the readership. As for Hogan, he talked about his dick enough on his own then denied the existence of the tape repeatedly until it was published as evidence. Same thing happened with Crack Mayor. He threatened to sue Gawker for saying there was tape of him smoking crack and guess what turned up?

You mean this article thats actually pretty on point and demonstrates that you, like Park, don't get satire? >.>

You may also wish to read this one.

You're implying that every GamerGate supporter to date is complicit in everything bad that's happened to its detractors.

Knowingly or unknowingly, yes. But at this point there is no excuse for being in the unknowingly category.

That does sound kind of silly. The idea that someone actually thought that up in a brainstorming session, I mean, not the actual denouncements themselves.

Except that's exactly what they did. And it worked. You're here arguing after all, aren't you?

How, exactly, is a grassroots consumer revolt an organization?

You actually believe it was a grassroots movement?

https://storify.com/davidsgallant/th...s-of-gamergate

Let's address the elephant in the room as far as that paragraph goes before anything else: the fact that you're claiming it's been nothing but 'misogynistic assholery' only proves that you're going by what you've read about, not what you've witnessed or taken part in.

No, I am going by the 4chan posts, 3000+ pages of IRC logs, etc. The attempt to make it appear a moral crusade over legitimate ethical concerns was a retroactive action. If you drank that Koolaid, you have my sympathy, but you are trying to represent a terrible thing created by terrible human beings.

That's association fallacy and I've seen more than enough of that on either side of this issue.

No, an association fallacy would be if it really was a well intentioned grass roots movement with only a few fringe assholes claiming to be part of it and I was treating it like they were all fringe assholes. When its actually the opposite.

If you want to hang out in the KKK's Klubhouse(tm) that's your prerogative. But don't stand there and try and claim its only a few guys in the back that burn crosses and the rest just have legitimate issues with affirmative action.

[ZedOmega]

That was before, check your timeline. -.-

Its also the only article he ever wrote for Kotaku that involved Quinn and its not exactly ABOUT Quinn now is it?

Unless there's something showing that Grayson and Quinn started dating in April, my own timeline is accurate as far as I can tell. And she was involved in the events the article reported on.

No breach there, though. /s

And have you seen the fallout from said incident? I believe they lost what, two editors over the first one and nearly imploded under backlash from the readership. As for Hogan, he talked about his dick enough on his own then denied the existence of the tape repeatedly until it was published as evidence. Same thing happened with Crack Mayor. He threatened to sue Gawker for saying there was tape of him smoking crack and guess what turned up?

Nothing whatsoever because the issue with 'Crack Mayor' was on how many different outlets at the time?

You mean this article thats actually pretty on point and demonstrates that you, like Park, don't get satire? >.>

Right. 'Satire.'

You may also wish to read this one.

So the fact that she had a drunken tryst while trying to present herself as being celibate is apt enough reason to run a smear piece because she's a hypocrite? Even her opponents said it was a low blow.

Knowingly or unknowingly, yes. But at this point there is no excuse for being in the unknowingly category.

There's also no excuse for claiming that the actions that're being decried are perfectly fine when it's your own side doing them. Doxxing supporters? Trying to get them fired from their jobs? Calling a bomb threat into a bar where a meetup was going to happen in Washington, DC? Meh, they deserve it, right?

Except that's exactly what they did. And it worked. You're here arguing after all, aren't you?

I'm here on my own volition arguing. Trying to make it seem like I'm following orders is honestly hilarious.

You actually believe it was a grassroots movement?

https://storify.com/davidsgallant/th...s-of-gamergate

A single Storify written by someone who admitted they were anti-GamerGate right off the bat. Yyyyyeah.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAJYmrKR8WE

No, I am going by the 4chan posts, 3000+ pages of IRC logs, etc. The attempt to make it appear a moral crusade over legitimate ethical concerns was a retroactive action. If you drank that Koolaid, you have my sympathy, but you are trying to represent a terrible thing created by terrible human beings.

By your own logic, I should be anti-feminist because Valerie Solanis and TERFs are associated with them.

No, an association fallacy would be if it really was a well intentioned grass roots movement with only a few fringe assholes claiming to be part of it and I was treating it like they were all fringe assholes. When its actually the opposite.

If you want to hang out in the KKK's Klubhouse(tm) that's your prerogative. But don't stand there and try and claim its only a few guys in the back that burn crosses and the rest just have legitimate issues with affirmative action.

Really. That's the route you're going to take with this discussion. Villainize everyone supporting it because 'they're all evil and they're lying to themselves if they say otherwise'. Never mind the fact that there's enough information to attract the SPJ's attention, it's all a group of villains because one guy had a beef with his ex-girlfriend and he needed a personal army.

You never thought to ask me why I got involved in this, did you? It only took a couple of weeks before the Quinn/Gjoni thing was pushed aside once August 28th hit. And judging from the tone of your reply in its entirety, you didn't even read my post on The Escapist's megathread, did you?

Now, I'm extremely loath to pick a side in all this because one side or the other is immediately going to vilify me, but I'm going to sum up what I feel about this whole thing:

Those of us who are the most involved in this are involved emotionally, and we need to back up and wait for the smoke to clear.

Seriously, we're taking a torches-and-pitchforks stance regarding a woman who, even though she's been shown to be manipulative and a liar, really is a small fish in the grand scheme of things, and the more prominent actors in this movie are way too emotionally invested in this to make a solid judgment call. Modern news outlets do this all the time, and the only thing that really happened overall is that the media personalities have been shown to take a 'worthy opponent' stance (Bill O'Reilly v. Jon Stewart is a great example of this), while their fanbases are the ones doing all the angry shouting at each other.

Whether or not journalistic integrity is being called into question is another matter entirely with this because of the emotional investment. Even Tito admits that the Quinn story was run without fact-checking, which is almost guaranteeing that his thoughts on the matter are purely heart-driven instead of fact-driven, and that's a luxury a respectable journalist has to surrender for the most part.

Let's all just back up, wait for the shitstorm to die down, then look at this with clear heads.

But nope, I've gotta be one of Gjoni's infantry if I'm calling for everyone to calm down, right? That makes perfect sense. "Let the smoke clear" was just my overlords' way of saying "DRIVE THEM OUT!"

You can make all the assumptions you want about how the movement started, what its goal is, who its targets are, who its leaders are, whatever. If you want to think that I'm a bad guy because a bunch of fuckboys in an IRC channel want to make a dev's life even more of a living hell, then you really don't know a fucking thing about me or why I got involved in this.

And by the way, this is me talking and not some prefabricated script some imaginary leaders told me to recite over and over again.

[Gravekeeper]

Unless there's something showing that Grayson and Quinn started dating in April, my own timeline is accurate as far as I can tell. And she was involved in the events the article reported on.

Unless there's something showing they started dating in March prior to the article its also meaningless. Plus the article, again, has nothing to do with Quinn specifically. Its not about Quinn anymore than its about JonTron. Its about a failed reality TV show.

The source of the claim about Grayson and Quinn was her asshole ex, remember. Who actively participated in the genesis of Gamergate on 4chan and IRC. That you're concerned with the "slut shaming" of O'Donnell but seemingly fine using the slut shaming of Quinn as a relevant source is interesting.

Right. 'Satire.'

Yes. Satire. You do know who Colbert is right? That's kind of the entire point of the show. An out of context quote from the show on a Twitter account Colbert does not own or oversee hardly an activist movement makes.

So the fact that she had a drunken tryst while trying to present herself as being celibate is apt enough reason to run a smear piece because she's a hypocrite? Even her opponents said it was a low blow.

and if the genders were reversed, it would be a complete none issue.

I'm here on my own volition arguing. Trying to make it seem like I'm following orders is honestly hilarious.

Thats not what I said nor how the op worked so you can curtail that line of "argument."

A single Storify written by someone who admitted they were anti-GamerGate right off the bat. Yyyyyeah.

One of many and its using posts and IRC logs. Shooting the messenger doesn't negate the facts of the matter.

Really. That's the route you're going to take with this discussion. Villainize everyone supporting it because 'they're all evil and they're lying to themselves if they say otherwise'.

The well was never not poisoned. Its also so far beyond poisoned now that trying in any way to cling to the label is pointless and reflects poorly. If you really have legitimate issues with ethics in gaming journalism or whatever the fuck, get the hell away from the label of GG. It will poison any argument you try to present.

You never thought to ask me why I got involved in this, did you?

No, because how you got involved is irrelevant.

You can make all the assumptions you want about how the movement started, what its goal is, who its targets are, who its leaders are, whatever.

I'm not making assumptions. There is a clear data trial of all of this.

If you want to think that I'm a bad guy because a bunch of fuckboys in an IRC channel want to make a dev's life even more of a living hell, then you really don't know a fucking thing about me or why I got involved in this.

Finding a reason to act personally offended changes absolutely nothing and does not bolster your position in any way shape or form. But I congratulate you on successfully making this about yourself.

And by the way, this is me talking and not some prefabricated script some imaginary leaders told me to recite over and over again.

If you can't even follow this thread I find your assertions about knowing the true nature of GG rather dubious. -.-

The well is poison. Stop drinking.

[Nekojin]

*sigh* Okay, I'll take a swing here.

I'm a Moderator on another site - a site that focuses on tech and politics, among other things. I don't normally mention that here, because it's rarely actually relevant. It is here.

Thanks to being on the Moderation staff of that site, I get an email every time anyone reports a post anywhere on the site. I ignore most of it, since I'm only a moderator for one subforum, not the whole site, but I do still see it - and as a result, I see and notice when there's a sudden flood of reports on something.

GamerGate was... something we haven't ever seen before. We had more reports in a single day after each new GamerGate article was posted than we normally have in a month across the entire site. And some patterns emerged immediately.

1.) The vast majority of the people who were actually breaking the site's posting rules were new posters coming in to argue the pro-GG side. We found out later that they were being called in from other locations - mostly from Kotaku In Action.

2.) For all that GamerGate is supposedly about "ethics in journalism," you couldn't tell it by the posts. For every single post that complained about anything even remotely related to ethics in journalism - usually mentioning Nathan Grayson in passing - there were pages of people arguing about Zoe Quinn, or Anita Sarkeesian, or Brianna Wu.

3.) At first, most of the people on both sides had no idea who Nathan Grayson was - even the pro-GG posters didn't know his name anywhere near as well as they knew Quinn or Sarkeesian. Once it became clear that the very fact that they only knew the non-journalists' names made it clear that they weren't actually there about the journalism, they started using his name more regularly, but still was a drop in the bucket to how often Quinn was mentioned.

Do you want to know how GamerGate really happened? Read the Wikipedia entry, or the RationalWiki timeline that make it clear what it's all about. And if you really want a squick-fest in seeing the true colors (har har) of GamerGate, go look up the history of the GamerGate "mascot," Vivian James...

It should carry some weight that none of the Moderators or Staff of the site I Mod for is in support of the GamerGate "side." We've all seen it, and most of us have been having to deal with it from the very start. The smokescreen came too late for us not to see it all.

[ZedOmega]

-snip-

You know something? We're getting absolutely nowhere with this. You could continue using blog posts, 4chan screenshots, Storifies and articles you want to and I'll still end up thinking that you could've done at least a little more research at ground level. You plainly refuse to, instead going the 'it's not even worth defending because these websites with a bone to pick clearly say it isn't' route.

As much as you like to say 'you drank the kool-aid,' it may very well be time to look in a mirror. If you can still do that and not feel even the slightest bit irritated with yourself, then take a look at what happens to antis who so much as take one step out of line. I've already given you two links in my first response to you showing you how acidic they can get; if that's the team you want to play for, fine and dandy. Just remember that they will and have thrown their own to the wolves for not marching in perfect cadence.

Then, if you still have the stomach for that, you may want to do some actual investigation on your own outside of Gawker. I'll even make it easy for you since you apparently won't check without a link to laugh at:

https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&...rGate&src=typd

We'll pick this up once you show me that you've spent at least five minutes in there.

[Andara Bledin]

So, half a dozen people with links and actual hard data on events as they happened, but you're just going to keep your head buried in the sand crying "lalala"...

Can't say as I'm all that surprised, tho.... Can't reason a person out of a decision they didn't use reason to make in the first place. >_<

[ZedOmega]

So, half a dozen people with links and actual hard data on events as they happened, but you're just going to keep your head buried in the sand crying "lalala"...

Can't say as I'm all that surprised, tho.... Can't reason a person out of a decision they didn't use reason to make in the first place. >_<

Most of what I've been seeing out of both of you and GK is 'they're still indefensible assholes' while at least one or two people have pretty much said 'yeah, I still don't feel comfortable saying if I'm for or against them, but at least I understand why one of their detractors isn't helping matters at all.' And as much as the argument with GK is doing wonders for both my temper and my blood pressure at this point, at least he's responding to at least some of the counterpoints I've given. The only thing I've seen from you once I posted my thoughts on this is 'yeah, fuck this zombie.'

In fact, the closest thing I've seen to a neutral response to the issue over the past months' worth of posts in this thread got met with a reaction of 'yeah, you're still a fuckface for supporting them.' The logic behind it? 'Well, if Sarkeesian and Quinn were guys, you'd have never even heard of them.' Yeah, let's continue making assumptions on what someone's reaction would be to an issue if the genders were flipped, yet claim to be the reasonable ones. That'll win points in the long run...

[Nekojin]

Then, if you still have the stomach for that, you may want to do some actual investigation on your own outside of Gawker. I'll even make it easy for you since you apparently won't check without a link to laugh at:

https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&...rGate&src=typd

We'll pick this up once you show me that you've spent at least five minutes in there.

I spent five minutes there. It's a waste of time; most people using #GamerGate aren't saying anything that even remotely involves anything with the whole GG fiasco. For the ones that are, well, it's been well-known for quite a while that the seriously dirty shit that GG assholes are planning, and have planned, get done in semi-private locations, like IRC channels. Even the particularly toxic GG'ers know to keep the very public channels (like Twitter) for the well-polished "good" face.

Even with that said, the shit that GG engaged in during the early days was enough to have GamerGate become what I understand to be the first and only thing (so far) to get banned from 4chan that isn't illegal in the first place. Congrats, GG, you're on a par with child porn, there...

But let's set that aside for a moment. Can you tell me, without looking anything up, three events from the past year that are worth talking about as "Ethics in Gaming Journalism" that have nothing to do with Grayson, Quinn, Sarkeesian, Wu, Pao, GamerGate itself, or "Gamers Are Dead"?

[ZedOmega]

I spent five minutes there. It's a waste of time; most people using #GamerGate aren't saying anything that even remotely involves anything with the whole GG fiasco. For the ones that are, well, it's been well-known for quite a while that the seriously dirty shit that GG assholes are planning, and have planned, get done in semi-private locations, like IRC channels.

Even with that said, the shit that GG engaged in during the early days was enough to have GamerGate become what I understand to be the first and only thing (so far) to get banned from 4chan that isn't illegal in the first place. Congrats, GG, you're on a par with child porn, there...

But let's set that aside for a moment. Can you tell me, without looking anything up, three events from the past year that are worth talking about as "Ethics in Gaming Journalism" that have nothing to do with Grayson, Quinn, Sarkeesian, Wu, Pao, GamerGate itself, or "Gamers Are Dead"?

Okay.

The most recent thing I can recall off the top of my head is the revelation that TotalBiscuit releasing a SoundCloud recently talking about how he'd had enough of the verbal abuse he's been taking over the past year. Before this gets met with a response of him being a YouTuber instead of a games journalist, he and the company he works for are almost revered for their goals to remain unbiased when it comes to reviewing (or in TB's case, giving first impressions of) a game.

The second item I can think of is the change of both Gameranx's ethics policies and Ian Miles Cheong's views of the so-called Social Justice movement, as well as the verbal abuse he'd been getting. This has relevance to the issue as he's the current EiC of Gameranx, and is on record saying "Who gives a fuck about ethics in games journalism? It's fucking games journalism."

And the third thing that comes to mind is Jim Sterling quitting his job as contributor at The Escapist and going indie, due to his fears of Escapist starting to show preference to companies that reward them with more ad revenue, and reaching the level of US$6k/month in Patreon contributions within two days. Relevant because of his and TB's shared coverage of the Plaid Social scandal revolving around keys given to reviewers who follow a specific set of guidelines Plaid Social wanted them to follow and their denouncement of such an agreement.

(EDIT: Meant to say 'unbiased' instead of 'neutral' when going over the first thing to come to mind.)

[Nekojin]

Congratulations. You have an immensely more involved and informed awareness than 99% of the GGers that ever came into that other site (Let's call it X from now on, so that I can just short-hand it). I'm willing to accept that you're interested in journalistic integrity more than slut-shaming, but that makes your tying yourself to GG all the more mystifying.

FWIW, though, TotalBiscuit isn't a shining knight. He strongly resisted disclosing when he was getting paid to promote games for quite a while, and only relented when UK regulators started applying pressure on him for it. I actually like his work, but if you're seriously interested in gaming journalistic integrity, you really can't hold him as an example. He is, and was, a hypocrite.

Whether he calls himself a "journalist" or not doesn't really matter much - it's what you do, not the label you choose to wear, that matters. And he has called himself a journalist in the past, when it benefited him. His line of, "I'm not a jounalist, never have been, never will be," is just fundamentally dishonest.

[ZedOmega]

Congratulations. You have an immensely more involved and informed awareness than 99% of the GGers that ever came into that other site (Let's call it X from now on, so that I can just short-hand it). I'm willing to accept that you're interested in journalistic integrity more than slut-shaming, but that makes your tying yourself to GG all the more mystifying.

Familiar territory; I was observing both sides of the fallout from TZP when both the hashtag was coined and the GAD articles dropped. Honestly I'm surprised the whole game journalism ethics issue wasn't resolved when Doritogate happened.

FWIW, though, TotalBiscuit isn't a shining knight. He strongly resisted disclosing when he was getting paid to promote games for quite a while, and only relented when UK regulators started applying pressure on him for it. I actually like his work, but if you're seriously interested in gaming journalistic integrity, you really can't hold him as an example. He is, and was, a hypocrite.

Whether he calls himself a "journalist" or not doesn't really matter much - it's what you do, not the label you choose to wear, that matters. And he has called himself a journalist in the past, when it benefited him.

To be fair, Sterling was a pretty caustic asshole prior to his learning about and supporting feminism. Then again, Destructoid itself isn't exactly a monastery either; Holly Green and Allistair Pinsof immediately come to mind.

[Gravekeeper]

You know something? We're getting absolutely nowhere with this. You could continue using blog posts, 4chan screenshots, Storifies and articles you want to and I'll still end up thinking that you could've done at least a little more research at ground level.

I don't know how much more "ground level" you want then the literal logs of the exact moment it was formulated and how. If you want to be willfully ignorant that's your business. But don't project that on us.

If you want to pick up the baton handed to you by a bunch of people that spent days talking about raping Quinn, hoping they end her career and drive her to suicide ( with guest appearances by Quinn's ex to talk about what it was like to fuck a fat chick and provide details about her business and paypal accounts for possible doxxing ) before coming up with a "real" cause to cloak it it under all the while sharing nude photos of her among themselves that's your business. But don't wave it at us like you're on legitimate moral ground.

I am not playing for any "team" here except basic human decency.

Here's just a small selection out of the 3000+ pages of what it is you are standing for:

Aug 18 17.37.57 <SweetJBro> lol I’m tweeting Zoe’s nudes to some of her defenders.

Aug 19 02.28.30 okay, is zoe actually depressed?
Aug 19 02.28.35 i bet she is now
Aug 19 02.28.37 <mugg> diagnosed etc?
Aug 19 02.28.39 kek …
Aug 19 02.29.22 <Opus> I think she tried killing herself before
Aug 19 02.29.28 <kailasha> she should try that again :^)

Aug 21 23.20.35 there should be a massive campaign to tweet zoe her own nudes
Aug 21 23.21.01 <Silver|2> They’ve been tweeted at her a lot

Aug 21 17.48.06 I’m debating whether or not we should just attack zoe …
Aug 21 17.48.29 <Opfag> push her… push her further….. further, until eventually she an heroes …
Aug 21 17.48.51 <OtherGentleman> … What makes you think she has the balls to kill herself?
Aug 21 17.48.57 I kind of want to just make her life irrepairably horrible …
Aug 21 17.49.16 <NASA_Agent> but what if she suicides …
Aug 21 17.49.24 <Opfag> Good.
Aug 21 17.49.29 Then we get to troll #Rememberzoe

Aug 21 18.26.37 <Cyberserker> You need a reason …
Aug 21 18.28.14 <Opfag> Well I don’t have a legitimate reason.
Aug 21 18.28.21 <Cyberserker> Nothing?
Aug 21 18.28.21 <Opfag> I just want to see her die horribly.
Aug 21 18.28.29 <Cyberserker> I’m talking about [your particular fantasies]
Aug 21 18.28.33 <Opfag> Oh.
Aug 21 18.28.39 <totality> sometimes you just want someone to get hurt
Aug 21 18.28.43 <Opfag> That, I have no idea
Aug 21 18.28.48 <totality> nothing wrong with that
Aug 21 18.28.51 all I know is I want zoe to die like that

Aug 21 17.49.48 <rd0951> ./v should be in charge of the gaming journalism aspect of it. /pol should be in charge of the feminism aspect, and /b should be in charge of harassing her into killing herself

Aug 22 02.02.46 <CutestGAmerGorl> Okay guys, how much does Zoe like being choked
Aug 22 02.02.49 <CutestGAmerGorl> during sex? …
Aug 22 02.02.58 <sarahv> clearly not enough

Aug 22 02.21.54 i want to smell zoe quinn’s armpits …

Aug 22 02.25.42 you all would fuck the zoeholes
Aug 22 02.25.46 <JTG> given a chance too
Aug 22 02.25.47 <The_Remover> I am extremely aroused right now …

Aug 22 02.26.47 someone seduce zoe quinn
Aug 22 02.26.53 <vanu> follow the shekels
Aug 22 02.26.56 <The_Remover> I volunteer to take one for the team
Aug 22 02.26.57 <vanu> to her vagina …

Aug 22 02.28.51 meditate to nude pictures of zoe
Aug 22 02.28.53 <The_Remover> she gonna get raped

Aug 22 04.50.24 by the by, trigger warning on that mediafire archive. don’t download if you don’t want to see zoe naked …
Aug 22 21.17.13 <JCTheDenthog> Zoe’s mouth must be the strongest vacuum in nature to compensate for her face, body, and everything

Aug 22 04.53.14 Eugh, why would you want to have her on your HDD? …
Aug 22 04.53.45 <The_Remover> because, a couple of months from now, when all this shit has died down, a raid may just be in order …
Aug 22 04.54.10 and i bet her dad doesn’t know she did porn …

Aug 22 23.00.55 <Drinky_Kraw> I don’t think there’s anything left to harass Zoe over anyway. …
Aug 22 23.01.00 <Drinky_Kraw> The laundry is pretty much all aired

Aug 23 05.40.20 <Josh_> Zoe has a gross robotic hand, blue hair, and tats 4 days
Aug 23 05.40.29 <Josh_> if I was forced to put my dick in one of them
Aug 23 05.40.29 <Josh_> Anita
Aug 23 05.40.39 <GribFabdabgib> If I had to put my dick in them, yeah Anita
Aug 23 05.40.43 Anita is a skinny bitch whos all bones
Aug 23 05.40.48 <DarkHiero> True …

Aug 23 05.41.07 <DarkHiero> But at least it looks like she tries to take care of herself. …
Aug 23 05.41.15 <Headsmash_> From just looks alone, Id rather do Zoe than Anita. Fat bitches usually give better head anyway.
Aug 23 05.41.21 <DarkHiero> If I’m putting my dick in crazy, that matters.
Aug 23 05.42.00 <DTrig> Yeah but odds are good you get the clap/crabs from Zoe
Aug 23 05.42.14 <Headsmash_> Same could be said for Anita based on what we know
Aug 23 05.42.17 <Headsmash_> lol
Aug 23 05.42.32 * DarkHiero shrugs
Aug 23 05.42.34 Anita looks like she douches though
Aug 23 05.42.36 <DTrig> ANd cleans up
Aug 23 05.42.39 Zoe…. eh

Aug 23 19.38.17 <Headsmash_> So does anyone think Zoe’s gonna off herself and become a catalyst for misogyny and hatred of women in video games and video game culture? …
Aug 23 19.38.47 if zoe offed herself she probably wouldn’t be anything but an ED article ..
Aug 23 19.38.55 <Araf> Headsmash_: She won’t, she has a too big ego …
Aug 23 19.39.13 <Headsmash_> I’m not too sure about that. I think she could.
Aug 23 19.39.16 <Araf> She would off herself if everyone ignored her and abandoned her, which is not the case. …
Aug 23 19.39.25 <Headsmash_> Depends on how much she gets stuck in the victimization complex. …
Aug 23 19.39.28 Really the 5guys scandal is the most famous Zoe has been …
Aug 23 19.39.43 <rd0952> yeah but she’s also been harassed night and day for a week

Aug 24 12.24.22 who really wants to meet zoe quinn and be kind and comfort her in this time of crisis
Aug 24 12.24.43 <Cyberserker> Not if you comfort her with a knife-hug
Aug 24 12.24.45 <Cameralady> and slowly, through friendship and blossoming relationship, get her to repair her shitty ways and come clean and become a good person …

Aug 24 12.24.52 <Cameralady> and then
Aug 24 12.24.56 <Cameralady> once she’s reformed
Aug 24 12.24.58 <Cyberserker> knife-hug?
Aug 24 12.25.07 dump her in the most brutal, heartwrenching way possible

Aug 24 15.16.10 <PaperDinosaur> Also Zoe is no longer the target to be focused on
Aug 24 15.16.13 <Josh_> ^^
Aug 24 15.16.14 <sarahv> ^^^^^
Aug 24 15.16.18 It’s about the 5guys
Aug 24 15.16.21 <sarahv> It always has been
Aug 24 15.16.28 <Josh_> It’s more about the journos
Aug 24 15.16.33 <PaperDinosaur> She’s done, we’ve wrecked her in a professional manner. …
Aug 24 15.16.42 <sarahv> Unfortunately most of the people involved in this seem to be interested in destroying Zoe
Aug 24 15.16.46 stop digging up shit on zoe’s past
Aug 24 15.16.47 <PaperDinosaur> Now we have to wreck her shield, the people who tried to defend her

Aug 25 00.02.21 <Cyberserker> Last question is from several people actually. I wanted to save it until the end due to how popular it was.
Aug 25 00.02.22 <Cyberserker> “Would you say Zoe was a “big girl” for you?” …
Aug 25 00.03.04 <Eron_G> she is heavier than people I usually date. …
Aug 25 00.03.12 <Cyberserker> Fair enough …
Aug 25 00.03.14 <ebola-chan> Did she not fly so good?

Aug 25 00.04.13 What does her pusy smell like must answer …
Aug 25 00.07.11 Eron, when you went down on her, did you taste the other guys semen? If so, what did it taste like? …
Aug 25 00.10.40 Eron I don’t think you want your headphones back, it’s most likely splattered in Nathan’s semen and Robin’s Menstrual fluids. …
Aug 25 00.16.52 eron are you going to take up sucking dick now that you’ve been cucked by the 2/10 ugly jew

Aug 25 00.19.28 <EronLovesZoe> I feel like I would probably fuck Zoe. But not out of a loving sense of sexual attraction. More of that “hate fuck” sense where you just want to assert your dominance as a male on her, a primal savagery. Then I’d probably have to sterilize myself to prevent the genome from spreading.
Aug 25 00.19.59 I’d slap a saddle on zoe and ride her throught the midwest
Aug 25 00.20.02 I wouldn’t even get that far EronLovesZoe, I’d just start raging and headbutting her and gnawing on her cheek …

Aug 25 00.20.10 that seabiscuit looking ass bith

Aug 25 07.18.18 <Logan> Any chance we can get Zoe to commit suicide?
Aug 25 07.18.29 if we can get more daming evidence
Aug 25 07.18.29 I think the [doxxing info removed by DF] is a good shot.
Aug 25 07.18.33 <temet> like her fucking a train of lack dudes …
Aug 25 07.18.39 <PaperDinosaur> fuck off Logan
Aug 25 07.18.39 <temet> black
Aug 25 07.18.51 <Logan> Nah 21st century doing a train is so 90s. …
Aug 25 07.18.59 <PaperDinosaur> If she commits suicide we lose everything …
Aug 25 07.20.34 <PaperDinosaur> If you can’t see how driving Zoe to suicide would fuck this entire thing up then you’re a fucking idiot
Aug 25 07.20.41 Imagine the kotaku article …
Aug 25 07.20.48 <temet> PaperDinosaur is right
Aug 25 07.20.51 <temet> not the right PR play

By your own free admission you entered into this on Aug 20th. When the festering core of it was just getting into full swing ( btw, part of the 4chan op was the creation and usage of sockpuppet Twitter accounts to manipulate the message ).

At that time you, from your very own post, showed no knowledge of the true underbelly of what was happening.

Yet now you're sitting here trying to argue that this wasn't a misogynistic shit fit organized entirely by terrible people? And are claiming that I'M the one missing evidence?

I don't think there's anything more to discuss here. You are either willfully ignorant or a terrible person and there's no point speaking any further with either one.

[Andara Bledin]

I just have to ask:

If you really and truly care about gaming journalism, why would you crawl into the muck that's been shoveled onto the GG movement?

If you don't want to be linked with misogynistic, sociopathic, shitstains, why in $deity's name would you join a movment whose defining feature is that practically the entire rest of the world thinks that it's full of mysogynistic, sociopathic shitstains?!?

There are actual, legitimate groups that actually work to preserve ethics in journalism; why aren't you fighting for one of them instead of this bloated, tainted wreck of a smokescreen of a movement?

[ZedOmega]

-snip-

Okay, let's address those chat log excerpts first, since instead of asking me what I thought of them, you assumed I was in support of them by proxy. Those assholes should be in jail for even planning that to begin with. Had you asked instead of immediately called me an asshole for the assumption that I was perfectly okay with it, I would have told you flat-out 'no'.

You're so focused on repeating the origin story and the articles talking about the origin story ad infinitum that you don't see what's going on here and now. Even the antis chiming in on the issue over the past month don't bring up the IRC logs nearly as much as you have within the past day.

And did you casually forget that the IRC channel wasn't the only place this matter was being discussed, or is 4chan the only origin point that you're willing to acknowledge? It's not like discussion on the issue was happening anywhere else, right?

You know what? Don't even bother. You're right about there being nothing further to discuss with you. You can keep assuming that it's still a harassment campaign because one channel full of members from one site wanted to make her life an even worse emotional rollercoaster all you want; that's about the only thing your argument even amounts to.

[ZedOmega]

I just have to ask:

If you really and truly care about gaming journalism, why would you crawl into the muck that's been shoveled onto the GG movement?

If you don't want to be linked with misogynistic, sociopathic, shitstains, why in $deity's name would you join a movment whose defining feature is that practically the entire rest of the world thinks that it's full of mysogynistic, sociopathic shitstains?!?

There are actual, legitimate groups that actually work to preserve ethics in journalism; why aren't you fighting for one of them instead of this bloated, tainted wreck of a smokescreen of a movement?

Because the side effect of the movement was unearthing the information that the legitimate groups would need in order to act on it, and unfortunately to gather that information, we had to pretty much wander into an inferno to grab it.

Like I told Nekojin earlier, I'm surprised this whole mess didn't start growing in visibility back when Geoff Keighley was being examined like a crime scene back when Doritogate happened. In fact, depending on who you ask on either side of the issue, the start of the increase in dubious behavior on the parts of the journalists could be traced back to either 2012 (IGN's termination of Jeff Gerstmann due to his writing an unfavorable review of a game the site was receiving a lot of ad revenue from at the time) or even back in the 1980s/1990s (Nintendo Power's coverage of games only available for their consoles; whether or not it counts as an ethical breach with a subscription fee depends on whether you consider in-house coverage of games available on Nintendo's consoles at the time an ethical breach or not).

In fact, even at this point, part of me's even wondering if TZP would've even been a factor in both the sudden naming and growth of GamerGate and the wave of GAD articles that spawned a day later. I still think it would've; it would have had a different (and honestly much more preferable) trigger for it.

(EDIT: cleaned up something in the Nintendo Power part of that. I'd be lying if I said this whole debacle didn't age me any.)