Book about corporal punsihement has caused death of 3 children

[Gravekeeper]

If you have have to reach for a weapon, you're failing as a parent. Even that aside, the book advocates you spank your child from the absolute get go so that you can break him of the habit of crying when he is still an infant:

"Once he learns that the reward of a tantrum is a swift, forceful spanking, he will NEVER throw another fit….If a parent starts at infancy, discouraging the first crying demands, the child will never develop the habit (pg 84)"

The entire book seems on that level of sanity:

"Training is not discipline. Discipline is the "damage control" part of training, but is insufficient in itself to effect proper behavior. Training is the conditioning of the child's mind before the crisis arises. It is preparation for future, instant, unquestioning obedience. (pg 4)"

"The military uses real bullets in training men to avoid enemy fire. Replacing the rod with hollow threats would be to your children like replacing live bullets with blanks. It would get the men killed later in battle. (p 53)"

"An athlete trains before he competes. Animals, including wild ones, are conditioned to respond to the trainer's voice command. (p 5)."

"This book is not about discipline, nor problem children. The emphasis is on the training of a child before the need for discipline arises. It is apparent that, though they expect obedience, most parents never attempt to train their child to obey. They wait until his behavior becomes unbearable and then explode. (introduction)"

Yeaaaah. >.>

This is my favourite:

"As a rule, do not use your hand. Hands are for loving and helping. If an adult swings his or her hand fast enough to cause pain to the surface of the skin, there is a danger of damaging bones and joints. The most painful nerves are just under the surface of the skin. A swift swat with a light, flexible instrument will sting without bruising or causing internal damage. Many people are using a section of ¼ inch plumber's supply line as a spanking instrument. It will fit in your purse or hang around you neck. You can buy them for under $1.00 at Home Depot or any hardware store."

Maximum pain at minimum visible damage that can be reported to the authorities.

[bara]

Pastors dont know how to raise kids.

I can remember 10-15 examples in school (thats a lot for my town), in which the worst behaved kid was a pastors child. Hell, there is one right down the road. Last I heard one of his sons is serving life for repeated felonies and I dont know when the other one is going to get out for attempted rape.

[bara]

"The military uses real bullets in training men to avoid enemy fire. Replacing the rod with hollow threats would be to your children like replacing live bullets with blanks. It would get the men killed later in battle. (p 53)"

Damn straight they do. But, we never SHOT at anyone. The live rounds were always shot down range away from all living things, in a very controlled MOUT training environment, or so over your head by the extremely disciplined marksman so that the worst you had to worry about was a 'wheeeee' sound.

From experience though, that 'wheeee' sound really makes you hug the ground.

[Gravekeeper]

Pastors dont know how to raise kids.

I can remember 10-15 examples in school (thats a lot for my town), in which the worst behaved kid was a pastors child. Hell, there is one right down the road. Last I heard one of his sons is serving life for repeated felonies and I dont know when the other one is going to get out for attempted rape.

Yep, I can think of two examples from my own high school as well. Overtly religious parents trying to raise them by The Book(tm) as literally as possible. When you control, punish and restrain a child that much, the second they get a sniff of freedom and begin to realise you're not the god of the universe they will rebel hard and fast. Usually going down in flames in the process. Typically occurs when they hit high school. -.-

One of my friends in highschool was one of the examples. He was fine in middle school but became even more and more of an asshole throughout high school till my mom ended said friendship. I don't blame her. He kept going down from that point, till he hit college then he moved as far away from his parents as possible. Like his older sister had before him. He got back on track after that, but still seems to spend a lot of time travelling just so he's not in the same country as them. >.>

His dad wasn't bad, but his mom was insane. When we came over to his place, she would audit our activities to make sure they were Jesus approved. So no RPGs in any form, no video games, only a select few board games were permitted but nothing with monsters in them ( Monsters could be Satan ). A single computer game was permitted: Links. Aka golf. It was the only game he had.

Bedtime was 8pm, no exceptions. Even if it was a weekend and we were all 14-15 years old. Periodic spot checks would be made through out the night to ensure we were in bed.

[Panacea]

Well, you know ... the Bible does say: "Spare the rod and spoil the child" or something along those lines.

There is such a big difference between discipline and cruelty. Words or blows, if you don't understand this difference you can do a lot of damage to a child.

"Once he learns that the reward of a tantrum is a swift, forceful spanking, he will NEVER throw another fit….If a parent starts at infancy, discouraging the first crying demands, the child will never develop the habit (pg 84)"

That's fucking child abuse. No if ands or buts. You cannot discipline an infant this way. You comfort an infant.

This is my favourite:

"As a rule, do not use your hand. Hands are for loving and helping. If an adult swings his or her hand fast enough to cause pain to the surface of the skin, there is a danger of damaging bones and joints. The most painful nerves are just under the surface of the skin. A swift swat with a light, flexible instrument will sting without bruising or causing internal damage. Many people are using a section of ¼ inch plumber's supply line as a spanking instrument. It will fit in your purse or hang around you neck. You can buy them for under $1.00 at Home Depot or any hardware store."

Maximum pain at minimum visible damage that can be reported to the authorities.

Well heavan forbid you actually hurt yourself punishing your child.

So much for, "this hurts me more than it does you."

Yep, I can think of two examples from my own high school as well. Overtly religious parents trying to raise them by The Book(tm) as literally as possible. When you control, punish and restrain a child that much, the second they get a sniff of freedom and begin to realise you're not the god of the universe they will rebel hard and fast. Usually going down in flames in the process. Typically occurs when they hit high school. -.-

Yeah, I had friends with crazy parents like this growing up.

One guy I knew (not a friend) was the son of a local Baptist pastor. He once tried to berate me in front of an entire class that I was a devil worshipper because I had the Dungeon Master's Guide. He told me I was going to hell.

He later went away to college, and then came out to his parents.

[Andara Bledin]

I know a person with a couple of kids. They're both doing ok.

Her sister, on the other hand, is a very strict religious type. So the person I know made a point of becoming friends with her niece and nephews for the express purpose of being someone they could turn to if and when they decided to escape their mother's smothering grasp.

As it stands, now, two of her nephews have escaped across the country to their aunt, a third is on the way, and one nephew and the niece appear to be following in their mother's footsteps.

^-.-^

[Seifer]

Violence should be the absolute LAST resort for anything, especially child rearing. Infants can't control their own behavior (they're fucking infants, jesus), so they should NEVER be punished. Young children (between 2-4, possibly older) are still in a developmental stage where all that matters to them is themselves. They can't fathom the world from another person's viewpoint, and all that matters to them is their own needs. It's a BIOLOGICAL issue - they'll eventually grow out of that phase. You don't "beat it out of them", you work with the child so they can begin to see the big picture. This is why sharing is such a huge issue in Pre-K, Kindergarten, and first grade.

Probably the age where parents really want to use violence to keep their kids in line would be the teenage years (since teenagers are known for being huge pains), but again, there are other ways to deal with bad behavior. Strip the teenager's bedroom of everything but the mattress and a lamp, if that's what it takes - as long as you're still feeding them and giving them the necessities, it's fine. See how long they can live without tv, their phones, videos games, the internet, etc.

[wolfie]

Even now, my mother doesn't class an argument as over until the other person is crying and asking for forgiveness, and I swear that she gets a smug little smile on her face when that happens.

And what about cases where your mother is WRONG?

From what I've read here, it seems that all a child will learn from this method of parenting is "I'm stronger than you are, therefore you will do what I tell you or I'll beat you up". Great way to teach your kid to be the school bully. Of course, when the kid is grown up, and the parent is old and frail, the shoe is on the other foot.

[Rageaholic]

For more details on one of the stories (and for some high octane nightmare fuel) check out this Anderson Cooper video on it. Basically, these nutcase parents beat their adopted daughter for SEVEN HOURS. The older one called the police, but they were too late to save her.

This Pearl guy sounds like a real creep. When asked why not use your hand, he said something to the effect of "it doesn't hurt". He says that the punishment must cause pain. While I can't blame him for the deaths of the children, I can blame him for his ifluencing parents to use harmful techniques in the name of "discipline" and god.

[Panacea]

This Pearl guy sounds like a real creep. When asked why not use your hand, he said something to the effect of "it doesn't hurt". He says that the punishment must cause pain. While I can't blame him for the deaths of the children, I can blame him for his ifluencing parents to use harmful techniques in the name of "discipline" and god.

He is a real creep. I saw an interview of him, he also said don't use your hand because you'll hurt your own hand. Inflicting punishment shouldn't hurt the punisher, apparently.

So much for, "this is going to hurt me far more than it will hurt you!"

'Course, when Dad said that to me, I didn't believe him. I couldn't sit down for an hour.

[Mishi]

And what about cases where your mother is WRONG?

According to her, she's never wrong. I don't want to turn this into another religious debate, but her excuse is that God told her that she's right... which is a wonderful trait for a medical professional.

[Panacea]

According to her, she's never wrong. I don't want to turn this into another religious debate, but her excuse is that God told her that she's right... which is a wonderful trait for a medical professional.

No offense . . . but then it scares me to think she's in my profession

[Rageaholic]

So in case you need even more proof that this Pearl guy is a psycho, watch one of his child training sessions.

No words.