"True" Christianity

[IDrinkaRum]

Thank you BlaqueKatt for the explanation I was trying to give through a haze of sleep deprivation, a sick child, a sick me and trying to remember everything I learned in church and trying to make it coherent. Whew - thank goodness for you! (and I mean that very sincerely, not sarcastically at all - honest).

[Slytovhand]

I've been looking and all I can see are mentions of it by His prophets. (these are from the King James Version)

Job 19:25 For I know that my redeemer livith, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth.

Matthew 24:21-31 tells of it although it is very symbolic.

Zechariah 13 and 14 also deal with the Second Coming although, again very symbolic.

Sorry I hope these help though.

Thanks Flybye... that's what I was after.. though I did think there was something in John's Revelations (not that I'd know ).

So...it makes me wonder... if Jesus didn't say he was going to return, why are so many christians waiting for this 'second coming'???

[IDrinkaRum]

The Book of Revelations? I haven't read it yet - It scares the crud out of me just thinking about it. What does that say about the end of the world? The 4 horsemen of the Apocalypse and/or the returning of Jesus? Or the coming down of God? Or whatever?

[BlaqueKatt]

Thank you BlaqueKatt for the explanation I was trying to give through a haze of sleep deprivation, a sick child, a sick me and trying to remember everything I learned in church and trying to make it coherent. Whew - thank goodness for you! (and I mean that very sincerely, not sarcastically at all - honest).

hmmm maybe your screen name had something to do with it

My google-fu is strong, my kickboxing needs work however.......

[AFPheonix]

I've been looking and all I can see are mentions of it by His prophets. (these are from the King James Version)

Job 19:25 For I know that my redeemer livith, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth.

Matthew 24:21-31 tells of it although it is very symbolic.

Zechariah 13 and 14 also deal with the Second Coming although, again very symbolic.

Sorry I hope these help though.

The only other place I can remember that it mentions Christ's return is Acts 1:9-11:
And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.
10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

[Slytovhand]

Well - I just tried a google, and really, only got 1 'definitive' answer that I was looking for (ie - something that apparently came from JC's mouth directly...).

Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

John 14:1-3


Though I am curious - why would he say "if"???

And I think to myself (probably cos I'm a pagan.. but then, if I was to convert, these are the sorts of questions I would ask anyway) - if JC was to return, then why wasn't he telling everyone all about it? Instead of it only getting a line or 2 in total, and that fairly cryptic?


Slyt

(who liked reading 'The Messsengers' by Julia Ingram and GW Hardin )

[crashhelmet]

I always took that to be a referrence to "Judgement Day" when He is supposed to return and take everyone that has earned their place in Heaven. A place that He has prepared for them.

That continues into John 14:6 "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life. No one goes unto the Father except by me."

CH

[Sylvia727]

In Sunday school, I always wondered why, when Jesus returned from the dead, he only showed himself to his disciples. Why didn't he show himself to everyone, and prove his miracles? If only 10 or 12 people actually saw him, how do we know those people aren't making it up? Especially as these people were in positions of status and purpose when he was alive and now were left bereft of Jesus' leadership, and therefore had the most to gain from rumors of his return. Did it really cheapen Jesus' teachings if he stayed dead? Especially considering that none of the gospels were distributed until after his death, when his disciples could have added passages to support their additions to his philosophy. When I asked how we knew the apostles weren't lying, I only got lectures on "Doubting Thomas", who didn't believe until he stuck his fingers in Jesus' wounds. (John 20:24-29). Which naturally led to the next question: if Jesus didn't punish Thomas for doubting him, Thomas who actually knew him and spent years as his pupil, then why would Jesus condemn modern-day doubters to hell? Christianity as a religion makes no sense to me, but the core teachings of Jesus Christ seem a sound philosophy. I mean no disrespect to Christians, merely that I personally don't "get" it.

[Flyndaran]

Didn't Jesus show himself only to a few of the disciples and then they took timie to recognize him... and of course he disappeared shortly thereafter... kind of removing the argument that it wasn't really Jesus.

Personally, I doubt the very existance of a single individual commonly called Jesus. It's right up there with the apocraphal jewish slaves of egypt... egypt didn't really keep slaves and a mass exodus would have been mentioned by someone at the time.

So, all this to me really seems silly. Huge groups of people worshiping a non-existant guy and arguing sometimes to the death about what he really meant whem he said something in usually only one of the four books dealing with his actions and teachings.

[Flyndaran]

Though that three in one trinity thing of Catholocism is right up there with Mormonism's gold plates only one or at most a few saw, and Zenu.

Only religion could get anyone to believe that 1+1+1=1

I may be spewing a little animosity. But it's partly that I hate that I'm incapable of being religious in the slightest. It never worked in my brain even as a very small and obviously odd child.
I must lack the god module, and at times I waffle between feeling special and feeling left out.

[Depot Denizen]

Not so much that 1 + 1 + 1 = 1. The Holy Trinity represents three sides of the same entity. Think of it as a equilateral triangle, with each part (The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost) making the points of said triangle. This coming from an atheist who grew up Catholic.

[Flyndaran]

Not so much that 1 + 1 + 1 = 1. The Holy Trinity represents three sides of the same entity. Think of it as a equilateral triangle, with each part (The Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost) making the points of said triangle. This coming from an atheist who grew up Catholic.

That means that Jesus wasn't a human at all. He was the creator and therefore knew everything that would happen and makes his whole life a mockery of our human pain and ignorance.
The trinity is dope smoking religiosity at it finest. No amount of mental gymnastics will make it anything but silly. One has to be idocrinated at an early age to simply accept such things.
My father tried a little, but my brain will not accept "obviously" false ideas like that, especially without a shred of proof.
That makes your god even more evil. Intentionally making a human brain completely incapable of seeing "the truth" and refusing to give any proof of such existance whatsoever is up there with creating evil in the first place.

[Slytovhand]

I thought mathematics could make 1+1+1=1 - no??

The 'Trinity' thing is most likely another thieving of paganism... there's lots of evidence to say that 3 was a good number for thousands of years before Xtianity came along (Triple Spirals as an example).

We could always take the line that God can make it any damn way He feels, and sod if it makes sense.... (which would then bring 'faith' into it).

[Depot Denizen]

I haven't studied theology at all, so I couldn't tell you. But if you really get down to it, he wasn't human, since he was hand-created by God. One could think that he wasn't bestowed with God's infinite knowledge, but that's for the theologists to argue. I wouldn't go so far as to say that, I believe it was a way to convey the idea of it to the Irish (using the clover as an example). And please don't make this a personal attack. I'm trying to convey my own experiences and knowledge from growing up as a casual Catholic. I've considered myself atheist since high school.

That means that Jesus wasn't a human at all. He was the creator and therefore knew everything that would happen and makes his whole life a mockery of our human pain and ignorance.
The trinity is dope smoking religiosity at it finest. No amount of mental gymnastics will make it anything but silly. One has to be idocrinated at an early age to simply accept such things.
My father tried a little, but my brain will not accept "obviously" false ideas like that, especially without a shred of proof.
That makes your god even more evil. Intentionally making a human brain completely incapable of seeing "the truth" and refusing to give any proof of such existance whatsoever is up there with creating evil in the first place.

[Flyndaran]

I meant you as in the general you for all monotheists. It wasn't mean as an attack on anyone specific.