"Rich" kid kills 4, gets probation.

[Gravekeeper]

There's nothing wrong with the statement he's shown no remorse, but it's also a dubious statement unless you really know a person. Some people are quite stone faced by nature. And we're in the legal world so apologies themselves may not be forthcoming for entirely legal reasons.

Its not dubious, because it's shown no remorse. As in, displayed none. Which is true. So, like I said, whether or not he feels any in private is debatable, but he has certainly displayed/shown none.

Also, he plead guilty to all charges. So there's no legal self implication if he should apologize or otherwise show remorse to the victim's families. But as I noted before, he refused to acknowledge them even when directly questioned by them in court.

So it would be hard for me to look at some random stranger and tell you what he does or does not feel about what he's done. Maybe that's just me.

Which is fine, but as I said, the phase is *show* remorse. Whether or not he feels it is another debate and perhaps one that could have been answered had they bothered to give the kid a psych evaluation. But I get the sense a legitimate evaluation would have undermined the one the defense paid for. -.-

[D_Yeti_Esquire]

There's nothing wrong with the statement he's shown no remorse, but it's also a dubious statement unless you really know a person. Some people are quite stone faced by nature. And we're in the legal world so apologies themselves may not be forthcoming for entirely legal reasons.

For me, he may be a heartless jerkass or he may just be a kid lost in an extremely real and f'd up part of his life. I can't even say how I'd react. I actually do tend to be stone faced to the point people actively do not read me well without me exaggerating my expressions. So it would be hard for me to look at some random stranger and tell you what he does or does not feel about what he's done. Maybe that's just me.

[Gravekeeper]

In other news, both parents have had numerous run ins with the law and his parents are actually divorced.

Most notably, dad has had a few charges for theft and one for assaulting mom. Also a litany of driving violations. And a mullet. Whereas mom once intentionally ran someone else off the road.

I don't think wealth has anything to do with it. This is just straight up shitty parenting. Which is not a defense in court. -.-

I just love all the declarations that he's shown no remorse, as if random internet people have been following him around to check for it.

There is nothing wrong with the statement that he has shown no remorse. Whether or not he feels any in private is up for debate, yes and we may never know there. However, it is true that he has displayed no remorse in the public eye, before the court and in private to any of the victim's families.

Which is generally what people mean when they say someone has shown no remorse.

[Andara Bledin]

Well, if it's not double jeopardy (and it sounds like it isn't) then hit him with it. He's shown _zero_ remorse and deserves a little slap of reality!

I just love all the declarations that he's shown no remorse, as if random internet people have been following him around to check for it.

They're holding verdicts aside for future leverage. It's a stick against the carrot of going through the rehab program. If he fucks up, they can go ahead and charge him on those, on top of the other sentence already handed down, and it won't require much effort as he's already pled guilty.

He's already given them the rope with which they can hang him. They're giving him a chance to prove he's not an utter waste. If he can manage it, everybody wins. If he can't, he'll go to jail, and probably for longer than he thinks he will.

[eltf177]

Yeah, but not for the controversy, they would have considered the matter settled. I don't know how I feel about it.

Well, if it's not double jeopardy (and it sounds like it isn't) then hit him with it. He's shown _zero_ remorse and deserves a little slap of reality!

[ebonyknight]

Yeah, but not for the controversy, they would have considered the matter settled. I don't know how I feel about it.

[Gravekeeper]

http://www.christianpost.com/news/te...nsense-111078/

As much as I want him to do jail time, they shouldn't get two bites at the apple. I have a feeling this won't go anywhere.

Well, technically its not double jeopardy if those two charges are still pending without a verdict as indicated. He plead guilty to them.

[ebonyknight]

"During his recent trial, the 16-year-old admitted his guilt in four cases of intoxication manslaughter and two cases of intoxication assault," said the statement from District Attorney Joe Shannon. "There has been no verdict formally entered in the two intoxication assault cases. Every case deserves a verdict. The District Attorney's office is asking the court to incarcerate the teen on the two intoxication assault cases," it continued.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/te...nsense-111078/

As much as I want him to do jail time, they shouldn't get two bites at the apple. I have a feeling this won't go anywhere.

[wolfie]

Kind of throws that whole "equal justice for all" thing right on its ear. This judge, and others like her, are making more and more people question or even downright laugh at the so-called American ideals of "justice is blind" and "all men are created equal."

I believe Anatole France had a good idea about how the legal system works: In its majestic equality, the law forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, beg in the streets and steal loaves of bread.

Sounds like the crash scene was really bad for the officers too. Its one thing to hear about it, and I've seen some shots of the kid's truck on the news. But digging up a picture of the SUV he hit? You wouldn't even know it was a vehicle[/URL] if it wasn't for the errant tire nearby.

If things had been slightly different (no passengers, and he'd hit the Peterbilt of Natural Selection), this thread wouldn't exist. It would have been a "squib" story - "DUI driver killed, trucker escapes with minor injuries". No slick lawyer could have gotten him out of that one.

[Gravekeeper]

Oh God. The affluenza psychologist crawled out from under his rock and appeared on CNN.

Watch him weasel around for 20 minutes and refuse to admit that his client killed anyone. While saying with a straight face that he will be deprived of his X-Box.

[Andara Bledin]

Instead he literally gets a pony.

In this case, he already had a pony.

It might be interesting to check his competency to see if he shouldn't be on a leash for entirely different reasons.

[Gravekeeper]

Any violation of the above would likely be considered a violation of his probation, and would land him back in court, though, depending on the transgression and its severity, it might not mean automatic jail time.

To put another interesting hitch in this. This judge is not running for re-election, she's retiring at the end of her term next year. Additionally, she won the last election by default because no one ran against her. So it really doesn't matter much what she does on her way out as she's already finished with her career. This also means its unlikely this kid will end up in front of her again unless he swiftly fucks up in rehab.

I found a tidbit comment that's been added to some articles floating around a couple news sites that's allegedly an account from an FWPD officer on scene and follow up at the hospital. Take it with a grain of salt but it would fit:

This kid was taken to the hospital for the blood draw for his test. Even after considerable time, his blood alcohol level was over 4x the legal. The whole time he was at the hospital, he was telling people the pills he took and how much alcohol he drank and was bragging about how he could hold his liquor, and after the blood draw, he asked if they were going to give him a ticket…and laughed. He knew nothing. He didn’t know he hit anyone. He didn’t know he had paralyzed one of his buddies in the truck. He remembered nothing.

Sounds like the crash scene was really bad for the officers too. Its one thing to hear about it, and I've seen some shots of the kid's truck on the news. But digging up a picture of the SUV he hit? You wouldn't even know it was a vehicle if it wasn't for the errant tire nearby.

He hit *people* at that speed. The bodies of which were found 60 yards away from the point of impact. I mean fuck, man. How much damage do you have to do and how much of it should society tolerate before your ass is locked up first, rehabilitated second.

Instead he literally gets a pony.

[Jester]

Probation generally requires that you stick to certain guidelines. Violating it would not have to be something as serious as killing someone else. That would be a separate crime, subject to different charges, though of course it would be a violation of the probation he's under.

This being an alcohol-related crime, it's almost a certainty that his probation requires him to abstain from alcohol. Since he has a history with drugs, he'll probably have to abstain from those as well. (That's usually part of any probation involving alcohol anyway.) He'll also likely be require to complete the rehab program he's been assigned to, and be required to comply with the rehab facility's rules. And almost certainly he'll be prohibited from contacting the victims or their families for any reason, though there may be exceptions made to this if some of them are friends or family, or those victims request to be exempted. He will also almost certainly be required to check in periodically with some kind of court-appointed probation officer, and to take periodic drug and alcohol tests.

Any violation of the above would likely be considered a violation of his probation, and would land him back in court, though, depending on the transgression and its severity, it might not mean automatic jail time.

[Canarr]

That still does not say what you said I said.

Though I will apologize for being snippy with my original response. Was having a rough night.

I wasn't saying you said that; I was merely asking, because I interpreted your statement that way and wanted to make sure. Didn't mean to be trolling; and I'll happily chalk it up to a misunderstanding.

I wasn't debating that. Though there should be a happy middle ground between the two extremes.

However, in fairness, we're not talking about these kids ending up in the general prison population. They're ending up in juvenile detention centers which do have rehabilitation programs. Its not great, but its not the hardened criminal machine you're talking about that is some federal penitentiaries.

In the case in question though, the judge doesn't like the juvenile rehab programs offered by her own state. So she tries to ship kids off to fancy places in other states on the parent's dime.

Personally, I find 10 years of probation not a bad middle ground; depending on the conditions of the probation, I guess. If he needs to actually kill someone again to be in violation, then it's not much use. But if any kind of transgression can land him in actual jail, then it's not necessarily a bad thing; would force him to stick to the straight and narrow.

[Kelmon]

He expressed no remorse in the courtroom and at no point did he address the court to expression remorse, condolences or apologies. He has not done so in private to the victims or the surviving family members of victims.

Family members were permitted to address him and the judge before sentencing. He would not answer them. Even when asked direct questions.

His entire defense was that he's a remorseless maladjusted asshole. So either he is a remorseless maladjusted asshole, or his entire legal team and their witnesses lied their asses off in court.

But you're pretty much making my point for me with that. If my defense depended on me being as unlikable as possible, I would do exactly as he did.

Of course, in his situation, I would have killed a buch of people too, and I would most likely be unable to face the families of my victims to tell them that "I'm soooooo sorry". Besides, I see such apologies in court as a meaningless, self-serving gesture anyway.