Miss California?

[the_std]

The same argument should be applied to gays making new families. If they're doing what families do, which is make each other happier, safer and more secure, even if you don't agree with it, why say it's a bad thing?

[Rubystars]

All that means is that they have a different definition than I do for family. To me a member of my family is someone either blood related to me, or someone related to me through marriage to blood relatives. If I were to get married then of course my husband and I would form a new family.

I don't think of anything outside of this as being "family", but other people are of course free to make up their own definitions even if I don't agree with them.

I'm not saying that it's bad or anything, just that I don't agree with it.

[the_std]

If they call themselves a family and act to protect, love, nourish and support each other without harming anyone, what's wrong with that?

[Rubystars]

So any random group of people who are fond of each other is a family now? Things have really changed, haven't they?

[the_std]

Rubystars, if smileyeagle says they're his family, why does it matter what you think of them? You're obviously entitled to your opinion, but in a case like this, it has no validity. That is smiley's life, smiley's choice to call those people family.

[Rubystars]

Interesting concept smileyeagle, but I would consider those more to be social networks or groups of friends rather than your family.

[smileyeagle1021]

I don't think there's anything that needed to be changed about this arrangement, but now it seems like 3 friends can get together and call themselves a family. It's just odd to me.

A saying comes to mind,
Every person has two families, the family they were born with and the family they chose. Some of us have multiple families that we choose. I for example consider my coworkers family (there's only 8 front desk employees and 4 shuttle drivers and 2 breakfast people, 1 maintenance guy, 6 housekeepers, one sales manager, and the two co-owners/managers, so we are like one big extended family), I consider many friends to be a second family, I consider my roommates to be another second family. I can't speak for everyone, but a lot of people I know are moving towards that attitude that family isn't just the people you share genetics with, but the people you chose to be related to.

[Flyndaran]

Not getting divorced is not always a good thing. Much of the time woman had no way of supporting themselves if they divorced even if they were being raped and beaten on a daily basis.
If two people can't be happy together then there is only stupidity in staying together.

[Rubystars]

Monogamous marriage between two people used to be more stable than it is now, with the high divorce rates that are now going on. People didn't get divorced unless they had a damn good reason. They toughed it out and worked it out. With that attitude, monogamous marriages were stable, supportive arrangements. Daughters and sons would grow up to see what a healthy male-female relationship was like and how conflicts were resolved in a healthy marriage. If grandparents were present, they could also pass down knowledge to the grandchildren. Those children would grow up to form families of their own with the model given to them by their parents and grandparents.

I don't think there's anything that needed to be changed about this arrangement, but now it seems like 3 friends can get together and call themselves a family. It's just odd to me.

[AFPheonix]

I wasn't talking about an abusive home. Just about anything is better than that.

That's fine, but you're saying that a married man and woman are better than any other family type with out backing up your claim with any actual data.

My assertion was to show that they are not necessarily better. A standard family isn't going to necessarily be worse than a non-traditional setup, either.
They are different, and can work equally well as long as there are dedicated caregivers involved, regardless of gender or orientation or even number.

[Cat]

Love makes a family. Whether it be born in to a "traditional" family, kids adopted in to a straight couple, gay couple, single parent..what have you.

"And don't criticize
What you can't understand
Your sons and your daughters
Are beyond your command
Your old road is
Rapidly agin'.
Please get out of the new one
If you can't lend your hand
For the times they are a-changin'." _Bob Dylan

And I am happy to see that change (slow as it is.....)

[Rubystars]

I wasn't talking about an abusive home. Just about anything is better than that.

[Flyndaran]

Marriage is a legally sanctioned promise between two people end of story.
Two gays can just as easily as two straights make such a promise.
I really don't understand why so many hate that concept.

[Flyndaran]

I'm an atheist but I will despise any religion that chooses to stand in the way of two people loving each other. I will shout from the rooftops my abhorence for such hate filled garbage.

[AFPheonix]

A wedded mother and father aren't going to guarantee the best outcome for a kid, either though.
How many married parents manage to traumatize their kids either by abuse of each other or abuse of the kids?

It's not that cut and dry. Frankly, whoever can create a stable home for a kid and make sure they get the proper things they need like food, love, education, etc. is going to be the most ideal situation, whether it is a married couple, a grandma, or some other caregiver.