Racial insinuation?

[Zyanya]

I'm not sure how much better I can put this. What that person did to Ariana's boyfriend would be the equivalent of asking a random white person what good Italian restaurants were around the area, simply because they appeared swarthy. .

I understand they are equivalent actions.

What you have yet to substantiate is your claim that the action is inherently and automatically rude.

WHY is it inherently and automatically rude to think that someone of a particular ethnicity might know where a good ethnic place to eat is?

I have a particular policy regarding ethnic food. If I go to say, a Chinese restaurant, open the door, look in, and there are no Chinese-looking people among the diners, I eat elsewhere. If I look in and see most of the clientèle is Chinese-looking people, I know the food in there is probably both good and authentic. Why? Because if you are of the ethnic group, you are more likely to know the difference between 'good' ethnic food and 'americanized' ethnic food, and 'americanized' ethnic food tends to suck ass.

Explain to me why this is racist.

[AFPheonix]

So, where is the difference between my assuming you were male based on a characteristic of yours and someone assuming he was Chinese based on a characteristic of his?

I see you claiming they are different and pointing out one is acceptable because there is no ill intent or insult, but I don't see you demonstrating the ill intent nor explaining why the first is automatically insulting.

And yet, simply having slanty eyes and olive skin does not make one chinese, or make one all-knowing about what restaurants are "good" in an area. THAT'S the inherent difference between you mistaking my gender and someone mistaking someone's heritage and then asking silly questions based on that assumption. You only had my written words to go by. Now, had you asked me about a man's view of some such opinion, that could be potentially insulting.
I'm not sure how much better I can put this. What that person did to Ariana's boyfriend would be the equivalent of asking a random white person what good Italian restaurants were around the area, simply because they appeared swarthy.
I'm not sure why this is a difficult concept. Have good manners, ask appropriate questions, assume nothing, and life is all good. Be an ignorant ass, and you get what's coming to you.

[blas87]

People like that are just ignorant of history. Slavery of black people did not originate in the US or by white people.

Not saying it was ever right, just bringing up a point.

[daleduke17]

I don't understand why some people would think that only whites can be racist, either.

Because that is what has been taught in public. Whites where the ones who predominately owned slaves. Places all over were divided into White/Black. Apparently being white is the worst thing that can be done.

[Lace Neil Singer]

I don't understand why some people would think that only whites can be racist, either.

Louis Farakkann is a well-known black Islamic leader, and he has often stirred up controversy with remarks widely believed to be anti-semitic. And that's just one of the most obvious examples.

Mugabe too; he's definitely an obvious choice.

[Zyanya]

Anriana was explaining the concept of "Othering" and used the phrase "Normal and white" to describe the attitude of those who do this.

Yes, I know.

And in doing so, she called everyone who acknowledges the difference in skin color as 'racist' and implies that only whites are racist.

[Boozy]

I don't understand why some people would think that only whites can be racist, either.

Louis Farakkann is a well-known black Islamic leader, and he has often stirred up controversy with remarks widely believed to be anti-semitic. And that's just one of the most obvious examples.

[Lace Neil Singer]

A lot of people seem to think that only white people can be racist. If that was the case, there would be no murders of white people by other nationalities, and the Black Panthers wouldn't exist. Oh yeah, and I guess this black girl who barged into me once, calling me a "white bitch" wasn't being racist at all, cuz only white people can be racist, right?

[Boozy]

I think my initial hypothesis is gaining support. It's the inherent assumption that white people are racist. Evidence for this assumption is Anriana's statement that 'Othering' is noticing anyone is anything other than 'normal and white', demonstrating her belief that 'white' is 'normal', and thus all whites see anything else as 'abnormal'. Once again, hypocrisy.

Anriana was explaining the concept of "Othering" and used the phrase "Normal and white" to describe the attitude of those who do this.

It seemed pretty obvious to me that this was not her own opinion, and that she was describing someone else's thought process.

[DesignFox]

Sorry, but I am going to continue acknowledge that people are different in many ways and all deserve to be treated with respect, even if that means acknowledging they are different.

And you know, sometimes, in order to treat someone with respect, it is necessary to acknowledge that they are different from you.

[Zyanya]

Zyana's example about her friend getting asked where there would be good Chinese food is a perfect one of how one can be kind of racist, whether they realize it or not, simply by making a mistake and an assumption about someone's background.
Making the mistake about my gender was an honest mistake and wasn't made in a way that was insulting. I'm sure there would have been other ways to make the mistake that would have been extremely rude and sexist.
NOW do I make more sense?

So, where is the difference between my assuming you were male based on a characteristic of yours and someone assuming he was Chinese based on a characteristic of his?

I see you claiming they are different and pointing out one is acceptable because there is no ill intent or insult, but I don't see you demonstrating the ill intent nor explaining why the first is automatically insulting.

Which is the point I was trying to make. I see claims of 'well that's different', such as making an assumption that someone from India could very well be Hindu based on the fact that most of them are, but no real explanation as to WHY it's different other than some folks are just adamant that if you notice skin color you are a racist in spite of all the evidence and reality to the contrary.

I think my initial hypothesis is gaining support. It's the inherent assumption that white people are racist. Evidence for this assumption is Anriana's statement that 'Othering' is noticing anyone is anything other than 'normal and white', demonstrating her belief that 'white' is 'normal', and thus all whites see anything else as 'abnormal'. Once again, hypocrisy.


Sorry, but I am going to continue acknowledge that people are different in many ways and all deserve to be treated with respect, even if that means acknowledging they are different.

[AFPheonix]

They were in a city. I'm sure there was more than one person around.

Perhaps consulting a phone book was just far too taxing.

[Greenday]

There's always the possibility that the person had been craving Chinese food, and at the time, he had been hungry and wanted to know where there were Chinese resturants, and that Zyana's friend was the only person around. Who else would they ask? If that were the case, it wouldn't be racist at all.

[AFPheonix]

And I've known ones that couldn't care less.


Yes and no. The thing I have been objecting to from the beginning is the insinuation that noticing race in the first place is racist. It isn't. Making negative judgments based on race is racist.

Assuming someone is from one country to the east of where they are actually from is what is known as an 'honest mistake', not an attempt at racism.

I don't disagree with you. All I've been saying is that making the mistake in a way that's profoundly rude can be at least seen as racist, if not downright racist in an of itself. It shows a general lack of concern about people and a lack of awareness of the world outside one's little bubble. Zyana's example about her friend getting asked where there would be good Chinese food is a perfect one of how one can be kind of racist, whether they realize it or not, simply by making a mistake and an assumption about someone's background.
Making the mistake about my gender was an honest mistake and wasn't made in a way that was insulting. I'm sure there would have been other ways to make the mistake that would have been extremely rude and sexist.
NOW do I make more sense?

[Boozy]

So, if I know that my friend is from India, should I still only have only beef dishes at the barbecue? I probably would if she wasn't coming, so why should I change just because she is. That is treating her differently after all. Wouldn't want her to feel I was 'othering' her at all.

That would be like offering nothing other than regular soda at a party to which you've invited a known diabetic. Your example has nothing to do with "Othering" and I don't think anriana would claim that it does.

Also, everything starts to break down once we start using examples of religion in a conversation about race. Religion is a choice that can have profound effects on how the adherents live their lives; race is not a choice, and doesn't necessarily have to change the way one lives.